The problem with Police reports is, well, police hate to write them. Now I don’t mean an officer would say, “I can’t turn in this undeniable evidence because I would be laughed at”

I mean police write crime reports. Or accident reports, but until a Bigfoot robs someone at gunpoint he aint gonna get a lot of ink at the local PD.

You call the police to report you saw “something” or “you saw a strange animal cross the road in front of your car”
Should your local Police dept. have a slow day or the manpower an officer might respond.
Remember they are in the crime and unsolved crime business, not the mystery / crypto zoology business.
The officer comes out to talk to you. He is looking for crime. Nothing damaged, no one hurt, no crime.
No ink.
At best you might get a “responded to unknown animal” note in the dispatch log.
You saw a large animal in the woods? Well that’s where they are supposed to be.
No Ink.
They are not looking for Bigfoot, They are not trained to expect Bigfoot.

If there was physical damage, a broken or damaged game cam for instance. And Bigfoot left fingerprints, and they were lifted and submitted and readable. (Big pile of “Ifs” there)

The police lab would not label them “unknown primate”. They would be returned “Unreadable” because they do not match what the lab is expecting, and trained to look for. The cop who lifted these must have smeared them or something; they are not ”prints”

Not “Human” prints would never enter the train of thought.

So one would not expect a lot of Police paperwork on Bigfoot.

NOI

Here's a couple of old ones. If witnesses would report a prowler or suspicious individual to law enforcement, you would see more police reports.


http://home.fuse.net/rschaffner/Richland.pdf

http://home.fuse.net/rschaffner/Boone.pdf

Ron

Now that's something to think about. I wonder how much stuff is in evidence bags across the country that might help our cause? Maybe just a few hairs here and there, or maybe a couple of pics we don't know about. The "Myakka Ape Photographs" were sent to the police station, how many more are out there that are collecting dust or getting tossed every year that we don't know about?

Veeeeerrrrryy interesting.

I cannot speak for other law enforcement agencies, but if my department receives an unknown or strange animal call, someone is making that location for the report. Animal calls are more important than you think due to the risk to human life and safety should there be something wrong with the animal. In many rural departments, the officers are trained to deal with livestock such as horses, cattle, sheep etc. and as a service to the community, will do the best that they can to correct the problem. Every call to a dispatch center is a "request for service" and each call represents a taxpayer. I dont know of any taxpayer that I ever had to deal with that would have settled for anything less than an officer coming to their location. In *some* instances, such as burglar alarm calls where no motion is detected or in calls where someone needs to document an event for legal purposes, an officer *may* not be sent, but this is usually dependent upon deparment policy, manpower constraints and other requests for service that might supercede your request.



Again, this isnt exactly correct. Officers are called for a myriad of reasons. Many calls are for documentation of ongoing problems at a location. My department has dispatched officers to "mystery/crypto" calls in the past. We have a large hispanic population here and their culture has several beings associated with various events and meanings. We have dealt with brujas (witches), La Llorona, and my favorite, the Lechusa (sometimes spelled Lechuza). Santaria is also a source of calls for us, although small.



Every call, no matter how minor, has a case number assigned to it, therefore requiring a formal record of the call. All calls are used for statistical purposes as well as for grant funding requests etc.



Police officers are trained to expect anything and assume nothing.



IF any prints were obtained, they would be submitted for a match against AFIS or other databases. If no match is found, they would be entered in as an unknown subject. No further analysis would take place, and certainly not any form of speculation as to whether or not the subject was an unknown primate or human being



Youre right there, but then again, its not something the are trained to determine either.

Well... I didn't find what I was looking for.... But I read someplace where a County Deputy was released from duty because of his sighting. (He claimed that the S.O. they thought He was crazy!) Well... at least that's what "HE" claimed. (I cant help but believe that "if in fact" he was released from duty... it was for something else. )

Anyway... There are actually quite a few sightings and reports by Law Enforcement Officers and Deputies. I quickly found three in my search for the story concerning the Deputy who was fired.

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_article.asp?id=129

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_article.asp?id=143

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=2599

AnotherPullTab,

You took just about all the words right out of my mouth!



It was the same in my former Department. EVERY call that was dispatched was given a case number. So, paper was generated for even the most minor calls.

While on duty, I never encountered any "Bigfoot" calls, but there were quite a few "Witches" and "Demon" calls. (Try lifting prints on THAT!)

Donnie

You might want to check out a book titled HIDDEN FILES by Sue Kovach. It is a compendium of law enforcement encounters with the paranormal. Pretty good book.

To go along with this one sort of, How many of these reports to the police have been handed off to the local animal control people ?
Around here if a call goes in and is about some animal that is who is sent out on the calls.

For the last few years here (About 10 I guess so more then a few lol) we have had a rabies problem with a lot of animals. Some areas they almost always have traps set out for coons and other animals like that.
I would be willing to beat that if someone made a call about some animal not acting like normal that would be the first thing on the police and animal controls mind.
So I would say they would respond to every call no matter what was reported just to be on the safe side.

Anyway if someone wanted to look into this thing, Looking into local animal control places would be a good idea also.

Yep that is what I have heard. I have a few law dogs in the family. They actually laugh about some folks that call regular to report a ''prowler'' There are three elderly couples that live within a couple miles from each other that call fairly regular. Instead of thinking there is something to it they think they are either ''lonely old coots'' or just ''scaredy cats''. I pointed out it was kinda odd for folks that live in the country all their life to get spooked like that and they just look at me like I am stupid. Very rural area, heavily wooded. So I get from talking to them they figure who the hell would prowl out there anyway. Just like we had an older lady claim a bear was getting in her garbage. They made fun of her because there are ''no bears in Alabama''. Well she got a picture of it in the act. Their response? They darted it and took it to Smoky Mtns in Tenn and released it because they said ''there is no population of black bear in Alabama other than in the Mobile delta'' WTF!!! Did they think that one hopped a Greyhound to get to her house???

Police here on avergae make about eight to ten dollars an hour and that in itself speaks volumes about the type of people they are to begin with.

Not necessarily. Before we realized that my grandmother had Alzheimers, when she was still in the early stages and could remember how to dial a telephone, she was calling the police almost daily. First it was the neighborhood kids on her roof, and then, after she was moved into my aunt's house, it was "The fat lady who runs the place [she thought she was in a nursing home and didn't recognize my aunt as her daughter] having wild parties." (When she had company over.)

I think even if it's not Alzheimers per se, a lot of people, as they get up in their years, get paranoid and start imagining all kinds ot odd things. It's not their fault, it's just the edge of dementia. And I'm NOT saying that the people you're talking about were like that Dave, they very well could have some activity that nobody will check out, but I think in more cases than not, when old folks call the police habitually, it's because they're not quite thinking clearly anymore.



You have GOT to be kidding me. That's criminal in itself! Why should they be motivated to give a rip, if they're not being fairly compensated for being in a high-risk job? That is ridiculous. I think cops, military, firefighters, and GOOD teachers (but definitely not the bad ones) should all be paid more than they are... OK, I'm gonna stop now before I go off on a rant and get any further off topc!

That and some of them are just desperately lonely and truly apprehensive.

It can become a sort of "crying wolf" scenario. You've answered so many calls that turned out to be nothing that you can, unfortunately, cease to take them seriously anymore. "It's just poor ol' Miss Stacy calling again about a Bigfoot in her back yard. Let's finish this cup of coffee then we'll go reassure her everything is OK." The problem is, just because you are senile, or demented, or crazy, or starved for company doesn't mean you didn't actually see something. But if the police have been to your house 8 times in 3 days without finding something, who's going to believe it when you have seen something, especially something that officially doesn't exist anyway.



Believe it Sister, he ain't kidding. That doesn't even get into the abuse of hours worked overtime without benefit of compensation of time or money in violation of Federal Fair Labor Standards Law. Some guys, by the time you factor their hours Vs. pay are making less than minimum wage. This is normally not a problem with large departments but is a problem with a lot of Sheriff's Offices and small departments - particularly in rural areas.

Law Enforcement is one of the few areas where you can clearly demonstrate a qualitative increase in your personnel that is directly tied to the amount of compensation. Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of good dedicated guys working out there. They are the ones who do it for the love of the job and their community. They tend to get swamped in the public perception by the actions of the one's who are there for the power, prestige, or because they couldn't get a job somewhere else but Uncle Buck had enough stroke to get them on with the Sheriff/Mayor/Chief.

I've known a lot of bright guys who would love to be police but they can't afford to be one. At the academy where I teach, in any given class, I estimate that at the end of the year after they graduate between 20% and 40% will no longer be in law enforcement. The 2 main reasons are financial and/or family/personal problems caused or exacerbated by the job.

This is probably more common in the South, but you can find examples all over the country. No region has a monopoly on the problem.

I've always found it a paradox that the only profession in the country that can arbitrarily deprive you of life, liberty, and property on a personal whim (not even the Supreme Court can do that) is one of the lowest paid jobs around. We pay people as close to minimum wage as we can and then rail in righteous indignity when they turn out to not be paragons of virtue.

Sorry about the monologue... just thought I would illuminate a little here.

StacyInMi,

When I was with the P.D. up in the Greater Seattle are, I was salaried at $27,000.00 annually. With the overtime, I grossed $42,000.00 annually. (1994)

When I made my lateral transfer to a small community here in Oregon, my salary dropped to $1,700.00 annually... and with the overtime I grossed about $26,000.00 (1998)

When Karyn and my marriage went on the rocks, I left Law Enforcement to try and focus on my marriage. I found other temporary work... but nothing steady.

I found myself at the Unemployment office checking into benefits. The case worker said that because of my previous job, (Law Enforcement,) I fell into the "Poverty Level Income" and was eligible for added benefits.

So... as a cop... I was living in what the State of Oregon deemed as the "Poverty Level". (What's up with that!)

Now... the Railroad pays "MUCH" better and has incredible benefits. I really feel bad for the Officers who work in these smaller town here in Oregon... because I know what they make, and its tough living from paycheck to paycheck. And they still respond to the same "Domestic Disputes" as any other Officer does who lives in Seattle. (I guess the Seattle Officers are now making over $55,000.00 annually! Good for them! ) And, from what I understand... there are small towns back East that only make HALF the amount that I made here in Oregon!

I have a lot of friends who are Deputies and Officers, and they ask me why I got out of Law Enforcement. First, I tell them about my Marriage... then I tell them how much the Railroad pays.

Usually... when I tell them about Railroad benefits and wages, it leaves them in "Stunned Silence." Many of them then ask "How they can get a job with the Railroad."

Deputies and Officers don't get paid "Squat" compared to what they are asked to do on a daily basis!

Donnie

Exceptionally good perspective on a very difficult subject.

VERY good perspective, APT, I agree. Thanks Ouachita and Donnie... I still just can not believe that officers are so underpaid. It's a travesty, it's ridiculous!

Thankfully for us, its getting much better. I just got a 9% raise and my co-workers got 15%. This was all due to the spectre of Collective Bargaining being on the horizon for FY '05. City of San Antonio Police Officers are paid extremely well by comparison. There are patrol officers with San Antonio that are making 80-90 K a year. Sergeants, Lieutenants and Captains are compensated exceptionally well. Our standard of living is not very high here and thats a lot of cabbage.

However, if you go right up the street to Kirby, Texas, their salaries are still in the $8-10 hr. range. Personally, thats the worst pay rate in the area here that I know of.

In a recent investigation we encountered a situation where a 911 call was made in regards to a Bigfoot sighting. It was called in as a prowler or strange animal report, but when the deputy arrived at the scene, he was told that it was not a prowler, but a "strange animal". The dispatcher first asked the witness if the "strange animal" had wings. The witness told her no, it did not have wings, it was like a "big monkey." The deputy said there was no written report filed because of the nature of the call. He said investigating a sasquatch was entirely unheard of and he and his Lt. decided not to write it up. Dispatch has record of the call, but there was no report written.

Report link

ecwool,

Those are the types of reports that would be interesting to read.

While reading this thread, I was reminded that not ALL agencies pull reports on every call. Many of the smaller departments will rely on a "clerk" to make a judgment call and decide weather or not to pull a case number.

My Department had a saying... "The thickness of a Department's S.O.P.'s will be in direct relation to the amount of times they have been sued." My department pulled case numbers on all "Dispatched Calls" for liability reasons.

I had a friend who was a Deputy in "Mason County, Washington." He said that at certain times of the year, they will get a rash of Bigfoot calls and sightings. He said that for liability reasons, they have to investigate them all... but many of them are written as just an "Informational report." (I sure wish I could read some of those!)

Donnie

First let me say that this was in no way meant to be a slam on Law Enforcement.

For the most part they are a dedicated bunch of guys and girls trying to do the right thing under dangerous conditions for way to little money.

The only group I can think of who take more risks for less pay is our kids in the military in Iraq.

But this is not where I wanted to go with this.

Agreed that some agencies have more resources than others. And if you look at what I posted as the calls given to police you will see that these are going to be given a low priority response by any agency. That is no one is harmed, and the animal is gone.
Under those conditions what is there for the officer to report? Darn little. The officer is looking for crime or immediate dangerous conditions. If none exist his report, if written would look something like this.

On Juvember 31 at 2500 hrs I Officer Valor was dispatched to 123 happy st. to a report of a large animal around a residence.
On arrival I spoke with the reporting party, a Mr. Y.D. Doit, who stated that his dogs had been barking a lot and when he went outside to look he saw a large furry animal going into the woods. I looked around the property and found the animal to be gone.
I told Mr. Doit I would continue to patrol the area.

And officer Valor did, for about 15 min. till he got the next call.
Then the report was filed and forgotten.

Even if the complainant got a clear look at the animal under a streetlight and gave a clear description it STILL is going down as an unknown animal. The officer will look around nothing alive is seen and he has other things to do. Report is filed case closed.

What I am getting to is we are not going to find a smoking gun in the police reports.

AnotherPullTab

Police are trained to look for everything and assume nothing.
I know I train them.
But in that training may be part of the problem. We strive for insightful reasoned logical thought and investigation. This in itself boxes in what we are looking for and excludes,what I will call , extraordinary possibilities.
I dare say that 99 out of 100 Police arrive at a call they are looking for a Human suspect.
Now that will suffice most of the time. I am saying on those occasions when, I am willing to agree, that a human is not the suspect, it will not occur to them to look for a non human suspect.

And anyone who doesn’t know how little your local Police are paid, shame on you, Its public record.

NOI

Poverty level pay for police officers should be scandalous. That's gotta be the toughest job in the world. Dealing professionally with the scum of the Earth while simultaneously dealing respectfully with solid citizens who push their luck is a difficult thing to do. You've gotta know the law like a lawyer, be able to grapple effectively with just about anybody without hurting them, maintain your composure at all times, and dress impeccably to boot.

They deserve the best pay, training, and support that a community can muster.

I do understand that we want to keep taxes down, but it is hard to justify not paying more to police officers to my way of thinking. These men and women put up with the worst behavior of the most base element of human society on a daily basis. I would think this would tend to shift their view of society as a whole, and not for the better. Maybe even make them feel it is hopeless, a lost cause. Seeing the result of the most horrible acts one person can do to another (rape, murder, spousal abuse, etc...) day after day seems it would alter the way they see their fellow human somewhat. Top that with ridiculously low pay and a job where the temptation to make a lot of illegal money is constant and real. Even seems the law sometimes protects the criminal more than the law enforcement officer. It is a wonder we don't have a lot more bad cops out there. Police can't be everywhere, so I try to be prepared to protect myself. But I am glad they are there. I can name at least one time that police probably saved my neck.
Police risk their lives for the safety of the general public whenever called upon to do so. How do you define hero? Glad you got a good raise, APT.
BSF

Not real happy about changing the subject like this one has but replying to what it has changed to.

I used to be a Teacher that worked with the police every day. I was a teacher at a Boot Camp for really bad boys (Every thing but Murder and some had done that we know just was never caught at it)
Anyway the guys who was called the drill instructors there was like starting out police officers. They was so lowly paid that some made even less then myself as a starting teacher.

My point is both Police officers and our Teachers are way under paid for what they do. They need to be in at least 10 years or so to be making about as much as they should be starting out. They are expected to deal with both the worst we have to offer the world and our young that is our future. Yet they are paid some of the lowest pay that almost no one would want to work for.

I worked there for 5 years and it was shocking the amount of turn over they had in the drill instructors. 90% or more left for higher paying jobs in a different field or something. I could not blame them then and I still can not.

When I started teaching I went from making $42,000 the year before to $18,000 yup that is a very big drop. And I was lucky as I did not start at the bottom as I had been teaching night school for a few years. So when I started full time I was sort of bumped up a couple of levels because of that.
The reason I started teaching was for medical reasons as I could not do the job that I was doing before any more (Was a plumber) And 5 years after I started teaching I ended up on full disability because of a bad back and all.

Anyway it is a damn shame that our protectors and educators are paid so little when they are some of the most important people we have in our world.

A topic close to my heart... Wish we could get paid more. As it has been said in the law enforcement community time and again, "I shoulda been a fireman, everybody loves a fireman." With ours, no matter how many calls for service we go on, generally speaking, at least one person there does not want to see us.

As for reporting, I work for a county sheriff's office and deal with quite a bit of rural areas. As has been said, we go expecting a person, unless the call came in as an animal problem. But unless the person states that it was "Bigfoot", or describes one it will probably be documented as a person, or more specifically, unknown person(s).

That's one of the catch 22's for cops, we usually show up after the fact and then have to rely on what others observed...or didn't but thought they did.

No doubt about it.

But, even more importantly, I think we need to make sure that we don't saddle teachers with police officer or babysitter duties. If there are disruptive students in the class, they should be immediately funneled into a class better suited for them so they don't screw everything up for everybody else.

And if they can't deal with basic discipline, kick them out of the school environment. Schools are for academics. The school of hard knocks is out on the street.

Everybody can't be saved. That's just the way it is.

hey craig, its too bad the sherriff or police can't call you to have calls like that investigated, you may have a better chance to get a good visual or other good evedence while its fresh. i think if the local law enforcement would allow the researchers to follow up on such strange sightings, maybe the mystery could be solved faster. i was listening to a police scanner while working graveyard shift at a c-store in central washington st. well a call came in from some folks who had an orchard out in canyon area, he stated he was hearing unhumanlike screams and crashing trees, he said it sounded like a war out there in his apple orchard, and was too afraid to go out there, because he had never heard anything like it before, i wished i could of gone out there right then, i never heard anything else about it, i went to the area the next day, but there were tons of apple orchards and farms and didn't know where to start looking.........

i feel bad for law enforcement folks, they are at poverty level, at least the wages are higher in places where the cost of living is high, but they still have low wages there too. if i lived in the eastern part of the state, i could make it easily on my income, or if i lived back down south. like law enforcement, my job can be dangerous, but we are not allowed to fight back, i work with developmentally disabled patrons, who have severe behavior problems, i work alone on graveyard shift, i have learned to watch body language, eyes etc, because sometimes all 5 of the patrons are awake at the same time, and 2 hrs from my relief. only one of the patrons are we allowed to call the police on. i just know this, if my wages don't go up substantially during the next few months, i'm outa here in may or june, maybe sooner, cause around here, if you have an emergency come up, and your not able to pay all the rent, they don't give a rats a$$ about ya, they give you an eviction notice......sorry thats another rant........... :doh: :doh: :doh:

I wonder if any police departments have been willing to send such reports quickly to a Bigfoot researcher?

I'd imagine there would be a liability problem. For example, if the police dispatcher got such a report, called a BFRO researcher who raced out there only to get shot by rampaging teens having a party in somebody's orchard, there would be hell to pay.

Newspaper reporters use scanners like ontheloose, but they're just as interested in fatal motor vehicle accidents and robberies as reports of wild animals. A bigfoot hunter might be listening to a scanner for a very long time before such a report was heard.

Still, I think more coorperation between law enforcement and an organization like BFRO could pay huge dividends.

My thought exactly Huntster.

If the police officer could refer the person to a reputable researcher after determining it was something out of the ordinary, I bet it could be a win-win for everyone. Think about it, your rural citizen will be, well should be pleased to get some special attention. Your BF researcher will be happy for the lead and your local police will have not only made a positive impression but actually put into motion a good solution.

What would be really great, now don't all start laughing at once, is some sort of standard credential for bigfoot researchers. Just some kind of credential that says the researcher coming on your property knows the difference be a moose and a squirrel so to speak. (Yeah, yeah Rocky and Bulwinkle come to mind.)
They could be bonded as well. In fact getting bonded is something any researcher should look into.

I think also, the wackos and quacks out there that attribute powers like mind reading, telepathy, and UFO connections to BF, and the ones that try to give it human intelligence and emotions really ruin it for any likely law enforcement/researcher cooperative effort. No policeman is going to send a possible nutcase out to investigate a call. Obtaining the credentials should include some sort of psyche evaluation, Coco.
BSF

[ Symbol used to denote the fact that the above commentary wrapped that segment of the thread up very well indeed! ]

* But a little voice inside asks.."What kind of a psyce evaluation report would be bestowed upon an individual who searches for Sasquatchs...??

Very good question, GC. Likely impossible until when and if the big pointy headed fellow really exists, scientifically speaking, of course.. Welcome back!
BSF

well for me i wouldnt make a police report. have had alot of crap happen, and unless someone called the cops on me or 4 me i have never called them myself. just not me. i think i am not the type of person that cops would waste alot of time on, especially if i was babbling about bigfoot. plus how many people call 911 when something may scare or startle them but really doesnt do any harm. and if something happened way out in the woods in bfe there r no cops 2 call in the first place.

Good points.

Many credentials might be looked upon favorably. John Green, noted sasquatch author, is a former newspaperman.

Former peace officers certainly have the right credentials to assure current police chiefs to route possible sasquatch reports quickly to a researcher.

I'll bet if a pair of sensible, down-to-Earth sasquatch authors like John Green or Robert Alley were to show up at police stations with a former peace officer researcher/responder to talk to police chiefs in key towns/counties in the Pacific Northwest, they'd be greeted with seriousness.

Bonding, if possible, would be an added bonus and sign of reponsibility.

Steenberg in BC, I believe, has a deal with some police station-houses that they will pass on reports to him. And I think I've read of some BF researchers in the US who've done the same. It probably helps a great deal to have a pre-existing "in" of some sort with someone in the local PD. I guess such arrangements would be undocumented and informal, and the reporting witnesses would be asked first if they wanted a researcher to pay them a visit or give them a call.

Several UFO researchers have also made arrangements with local PDs. Peter Davenport of NUFORC has even established a relationship with the FAA for airport controllers to pass along reports to him.