Why doesn't someone with major financial backing just take a helicopter and survey areas of recent sightings with one of those high quality infra-red cameras they use in police pursuits?

Very simple... no major financial backing.

When I win the lottery, first thing on my list!!!

Let's get Richard Branson on the phone!! Seriously, I wonder if anybody has ever broached the subject with him. He has pots of money and is always doing some interesting projects or other.

My bet is that if he looked at the subject seriously then he'd be a great option.

I remember watching a show a long time ago where something like that was done.
A helilcopter-borne camera crew swept down a random area of woods in Oregon or Washington. I wouldn't call it "optimal conditions" since they didn't do the logical thing of finding a "hotspot" for sightings and sweeping that, but I think it did show a difficulty with this technique: heavy woods.

Those IR cameras that the police helicopters use do not really penetrate foliage. If a Bigfoot instinctively heads for deep woods when feeling "threatened" (which I do think is the case based upon the sightings to date) it probably wouldn't be seen at all. So long as the overhead cover of leaves was thick enough (and standing against the trunk of any really large tree would probably do it), a chopper could buzz past overhead and it wouldn't be seen.

What might be accomplished with military-grade equipment (the sensors are designed for things like cutting through foliage and the aircraft fly so high you wouldn't hear them on the ground and be aware of them) is an interesting thought.

I have my doubts, however. Even military equipment is "successful" if you can find a single man in a 20 or 30. It lets you know a potential enemy is in the area.

I'm not sure anything is up to the task of finding a single, fast-moving "creature" that has a good ability to hide in heavy foliage in rought terrain. In truth, the best way to find such a "thing" is probably a fresh set of tracks and a person who really is skilled in tracking and is in good shape to keep up the pace and close in.

What about those CAMP choppers that (used to) fly over No. California forests? Can they see animals and people in the woods at night with their IR equipment? Is CAMP still active? Any interesting reports from their pilots?

bigstinkyfoot are you talking about the choppers they use to find Pot Fields in the forests? Those are still flying and as a matter of fact will be in the air in the next few weeks or so. They look for large areas of temperature differences such as a pot field in contrast to the regular woods. I don't know if they are efficient enough to see something as small as Bigfoot would be in comparison.

I also agree with OnlyASize12 and the thought of the forest canopy being just too thick for the IR to penetrate. If it was able to be used in this way, don't you think they would already be in use to find missing hikers and hunters in the woods? Every year we lose a number of people in the woods out here, and to date I've never heard of a chopper with IR equipment being used in this manner.

I agree. The forest canopies are so thick that when out hunting in the Pacific Northwest I have to find high ground or a clearing to get a GPS fix. It just won't happen through the thick foliage. I have also been involved in search and rescue operations and IR has been suggested because it has been successful in the east but it will not penetrate the dense forest of the West Coast in most areas.

Personally I think the best and easiest bet is to not worry about the middle of dense forests. Stay away from them. The coastal tidal flats and estuaries of remote British Columbia would be the way to go. That will get the best results. I'm sure of it. Spend a lot of time and money scouting those areas. Set up a large number of hides and also cruise by boat. A number of sightings have come about by boat looking towards shore. Some at quite close distance.

Just my view. That's what I'd do if I had unlimited time and money. The coastal areas of BC would be number one for me.

That!...and southeastern Alaska!

Anyone remember Hands Across America?

If only they'd have done a sweep from the Canadian border, south to the tip of Florida/Texas, we'd have our proof!!

Kinda like this, only the people would be really, really tiny:





RayG

I think the best bet if you have time is to go camp out with the Pot farmers in Del Norte county with your camera or 30-06 for the summer,

Yes, I overlooked southern Alaska. Well it borders BC so I shouldn't have. It's more or less the same.

I really do think this particular area ( B.C/ southern Alaska coast and mountains) must be surely THE main place in North America. So rugged, so unspoilt, so remote, so uninhabited. My guess is that's where the highest concentrations of B/F will be found by far. No disrespect to anywhere else of course but that's the real deal in my view. Maybe that's why there's been no success yet? The main concentrated efforts are in the wrong place?

Anybody know of any major expeditions in this area?

I know of no exbiditions in that area I believe that is the area where George Bush is trying to open up to logging. It might become the next Bluff Creek, Bluff Creek as you probally know became famous when road building for logging started in the late 1950's. Some of the best evidence was discovered for next ten years. It seemed the Biggie's were very currious about the new residence in the area.

I still feel that one of the best things to do again is an exact as much as possible replica of the the Patterson/Gimlin expidition.

Don't use any equipment that was not available then. If possible use vintage camping equipment as well as natural fiber clothing. Don't even wash the clothes is detergent that wasn't available then.

I have always felt that what made P/G successful was the way they went about the expidition. There was not a lot of hoopla, no buzzing electronics and they spent every day on horseback exploring and filming.

I am not saying that Patty deliberately showed herself that day, nor do I think it is a hoax. But I do feel that Patterson and Gimlin had been observed long enough by all the forest fauna to no longer pose any significant threat.

I know Mr. Gimlin is a very gracious man. He is also still interested in Bigfoot as well. If I could have an interview with him I would ask for as detailed as possible a list of items used on the expidition as well as what food they ate.

Granted it's just a hunch. But it is still the best Bigfoot expidition we have. I still think that the details of the expidition matter. In a real scientific experiment all the steps, procedures and conditions have to be exactly reproduced.

Patterson was a vegeterian, and that is a good idea of asking about the food. I have heard it said that the sound of horse hoofs might of not concerned Pattie. The sound of the water might have concealed some her hearing. I believe Gimlin would stand more to gain to say it a hoax if it was, then do the occansional documentary interview. That is what seals the deal as far as truth of that film. As far as duplicating the trip it would be better to do it that way then any other way. Maybe driving roads at night is second best for those without all of stuff they had.

I still think it would a good idea for them to come to us or at least make the first move. Build a number of huts or hides, have enough manpower to man each hide or hut (permanent camps for months and months with provisions flown or boated in every so often) then actually become 'part' of the local wildlife and scenery. It will take a long time but I think that would work eventually. If there is a large number of paid participents doing this job all dotted everywhere and all over the place then I'm sure success would come to at least one of these people.

Remote huts and cabins seem to have visited frequently from America to Siberia. It seems to be a reccuring theme. That's the best bet.

Another point about IR is that on Mysterious Encounters Autum said she was looking for a moving cold spot, not juts a warm spot, because if the fur insulated liek its meant to you wouldn't see a heat signature. Not sure if this is BS and just thier way of explaining lack of evidence, but it sounds logical.

I remember reading about an American rockstar that went out hunting for BF a year. I don´t remember his name but it wasn´t any of the guys from the Beastie Boys

Ted Nuggent?

Why don't you get a house boat, hook some cameras on it and leave it in a big body of water. If they're in the area, they'll get used to it, and maybe drop they'll drop their guard a little. Even if you don't see them it will be a good place for relaxation/bigfootery. It will be like your own campground


Edited because I think faster than I type, so I forgot like six words

I wonder if anyone has tried thermal imaging device like the military use to hunt BF...?

Hands across America? :doh: How many poeple do you think you would loose to some pissed off Mountain Lions, Bears, and disease, and imagine trying to feed a large number of people spread accross a large area, then there's sleeping conditions.

By the time such a line made 5 miles I would expect a 30% loss due to injury, fatigue, and animal attack.

The Feds do use helicopters to find missing hikers/hunters, and if the person is in the open, they are generally found. If someone isn't found, 99% we later find that the missing person had hid under a bush/rock, etc. and we just couldn't see them. The Forest Service (who I work for) does NOT have IR or a thermal camera...they do not search for missing folks at night in a helicopter.

We do use helicopters to search for pot groves and we are very successful. Generally though, we find the groves not the people because the run and hide when they hear the helicopter coming!

There are a lot of reasons why a helicopter might be as successful as we hope.
1) Too expensive. Pilot time; fuel; helicopter for a week is an average of $20000.
2) Permission. You can't fly in the wilderness unless you have to have permission from the Federal agency to do so, and permission will not be granted for non-emergency activities. Plus, based on my understanding, in non-wilderness areas, the local air-control agency has to give permission for you to fly just above the tree line.
3) You can hear it a long way away...so why would a bigfoot stay out in the open?

Just my .02 cents!

Should use this baby. I think it has a quiet mode!

The guy from the cryptozoology institute Richard, man I can't remember his last name. Well he and a few others took mules way back into mountains of Northren Ca, and camped out in the same spot for a week or so, and had had something visting the camp at nights. Richard Greenwell that's his name! Well he seems to be a very reliable person. That has to be the best way to do it if you had the time to do it. Take about three people max, and set up camp. And just camp like all is normal. Have your handy dandy game cams set up all around camp. Get a good picture of Bigfoot and take it back to the world and have it debated for 37 years.

If you can have some large financial backing then send out many many such groups of two to three people and let them remain in the area for months at a time. Many months of a large number of suchlike groups will I'm sure have success.

I totally agree that would be the best way, the only problem is that most people don't have the time are money to undertake such a thing. I will do it if eveybody on the forum will chip in and make my house payment. So other than the occasional trip out into the field I would think most Bigfooter's have other responsibility's. As far as getting funding from a major organazation you would have to be somebody. That is why for us Joe Shmoo's making the most out of our time is important. I think everybody would agree that highest percentage of sighting's take place from vechicles. Camp out in good area and drive the roads at night. Have a good spotlight, dash mounted video camera and high powered rifle. That way if you decide not to shoot at least you might have some film. Two people would be needed to pull this off right.

I like Lyndon's idea and the southeast Alaska idea. Just got back from a 7 day Alaska cruise with my wife about a month ago (It was great). I read Rainforest Sasquatch shortly before the cruise. It was really interesting how many southeast Alaska and British Columibia sitings were reported along the shore, but I guess this is an extremely remote and inaccessible area and most people are along the shore. I think a boat equipped with one of the really good FLIR (forward looking Infrared) devices would be an excellent way to spot a BF in water or near the shore. I believe there is a great chance that one of these infrared cameras is going to get some pretty compelling evidence someday.

Forget Blue Thunder! Here's your copter and crew.

How about a hot air balloon or two, they would be real quite unlike a helicopter. Would be neat floating around at night with some night vision equipment, etc. Paul and Lena Bottriell used one in Africa to find a King Cheetah.


Mark

I don't understand that why when they left bait at the "Skookum" cast site and if they really thought they would attract something why there were no cameras in place. No disrespect at to the researchers I was just curious about this aspect.


Lee

Hey on the Airwolf thing that crew kind of scares me..a one eyed guy a really really old dude gotta have the girl and that dunk guy. No chance.

Hey Oak! Haven't seen you in a while. Good to see you posting and good idea.A ballon would be much quieter and I think you would have a little more time to search and maybe not miss as much.

Mike

Why would a Balloon be quieter? Have you ever heard one going over your house? They need to maintain altitude and the only way to do is to fire up the burner...and that is very noisy.

Not as loud as a helicopter. Depending on altitude and relative location, you can almost feel a chopper's noise.

Ok not the steady noise, but still noisy. Am I wrong?

You are correct. The furnace,(or whatever they call the damn thing that heats the air), does makes noise and the thought just occured to me; don't they glow or light up at night because of the flame used to heat the air? Any ballonist out there?







*edit for spelling*

If absolute silence were needed, a helium balloon or blimp could be used. If a blimp, motors could be powered by a battery. If unmanned, hydrogen could be used to reduce the expense.

Sure, you will find them right under your Tricorder. Its right there next to your Klingon dictionary and Bong..

Freak show!

Tethered balloons, presumably helium or hydrogen filled, have already been used as platforms for cameras to observe wildlife. One instance was mentioned above, and I've also read that the Chinese employed the technique in 1992.

EDIT: In the current Search From the Air thread, Volsquatch (8/21) also gave a reference to a source for a cheap ($80) remote-controlled toy blimp at http://raidentech.com/rarecorcblrc.html

You lucky so and so. If only........

I bet you had your eyes peeled shorewards through your binoculars!!!

I had posted the following in another thread but this fits better in this thread:
======

In my opinion, it shouldn't be a race to the discovery. It should be a combined effort to ending this once and for all. Maybe if there were a few less secrets, someone would have already put the puzzle together and ended this search.

I'm a Search Manager for our local Search and Rescue team. When a search for a lost child is in action, we receive all the clues from all the teams out there. This helps us put the puzzle together and hopefully know where to look harder for the child. If anyone holds back information, so they can be 'the one' who finds them, then the child’s life is at stake. When the child is found, it's the 'whole team' who has helped find them.... not the person who makes the fist contact.

If you ask me we need all information to go to one point. If that’s the BFRO, then so be it but… everyone in the BFRO needs to have all the information… not just bits and pieces and some holding back information so ‘they’ can have the find! Then maybe, just maybe, the ‘Team’ will be able to put the puzzle together and help put teams in the right place to have a successful search.

If I were told to manage this search, that’s how I would run it.

Cut4sign

:clap:

I have been trying to say that very thing, myself, since I got here. Is teamwork dead, as far as BFF'ery goes?

Hey Mike, good to see you posting as well! It was just a spur of the moment idea. Helium would be better like mentioned earlier. Just don't inhale it and talk, you might get the BFs a laughing and looking around for the munchkin!

There was a show on OLN last night about bigfoot. A research group used a nightvision camera system hung on the underside of a tethered balloon to survey a wide area about them in the night. Interesting concept, but they really didn't get anything on film.

I believe that show will repeat in a few weeks. It wasn't a great program, but it was about bigfoot.

Check the Outdoor Life Network website for airtimes

Prehaps something like the security blimp may help solve the mystery, would love to have one.



Security blimp tested in Washington skies

Wednesday, September 29, 2004 Posted: 10:37 AM EDT (1437 GMT)

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Here's a head-turner for a security-nervous city: A large white object was spotted in the skies above the nation's capital in the pre-dawn hours Wednesday.


Pentagon police said the Defense Department is testing a security blimp -- fully equipped with surveillance cameras. The white blimp was spotted early Wednesday morning hovering at various times over the Pentagon and the U.S. Capitol.

The 178-foot-long device, which is expected to remain in the skies until Thursday, is conducting a mission for the Defense Department.

Authorities say the airship is equipped with infrared cameras designed to provide real-time images to military commanders on the ground. The equipment on the blimp already is being used to protect troops in Afghanistan and Iraq.

The Army says the device will make at least one 24-hour flight in the District of Columbia area. It has been in the region since last week, and is also being used for test runs over the U.S. Marine Corps Base in nearby Quantico, Virginia, and the Chesapeake Bay.


http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/09/29/security....p.ap/index.html

evryone has great ideas, but, it is like wanting to loose weight, but only if u take a pill drink a gallon of water and BAM -50lbs. YOU have to actually get out there and look. no clothing that is washed in detergent, no cooking meals, no fires, no bug spray, no bodily functions in the woods, you would have to go in streams or rivers, that way there is no scent or evidence of man being in the area. i will be back in OCT of next year if i get out, it will be in Jan. mar 1st i will be looking for areas for a month to two month trip, i am thinking April to May.

No bug spray, YIKES! I was out yesterday and forgot to spray my self down and wished that I had. Man those mosquitos are BAD here where IM at. I probably have the West Nile Virus now, hope not. I toughed it out for about two hours sitting behind a blind but had to abandon because those humming bird sized skeeters were leaving me in havoc, I felt like someone had beat me up with a baseball bat. They would bite through three layers of clothes and I was steady swatting.

I remember the old timers around use to drink sulfur and water mixed and mosquitos didn't bother them, that's one alternative to bug spray ... if you could stand it.

Now we're talking! I wonder if the crew running this in Quantico are seeing more then they bargined for

It seems a little too big and way too expensive for your average BF'n trip.

Cut4sign

Maybe something more like this guy.