Something just occured to me. On the P/G, why do Patty's arms swing so much? If it is, as the skeptics say, simply a guy in a suit, why such a drastic swing of the arms? Do you know anybody that swings their arms so much when they walk?
If it is in fact a guy in a suit, was the drastic arm swing done to somehow add more definition? "Look how long my arms are!"

It is a good question to ask. Why would a guy in a suit swing his arms so hard?

It is easier to speculate on a real creature. She is massive, even assuming a walking height around the 6 foot range. The arm swing would be higher in a larger animal. There was a recent thread where some scientist acted surprised that swinging the arm actually helps people walk. It would be very uncomfortable for me to walk miles with my arms not allowed to swing. It helps balance and seems to make walking much easier. I would assume that larger arms would be needed for a much more massively built creature. They would probably also swing harder.

It would seem to be hard for a smaller person in a suit to swing the arms so naturally.

So you don't have to imagine it.

I'll be running out here soon, so I'll have to keep my eyes open and watch people. Never noticed if larger folks swing their arms more. I'm 5'11 and I don't thing I swing my arms that much.
I know theres more than one guy claiming to be the guy in the suit, but how tall is Bob H?

I guess it all depends on what is needed for balance. This may also be why some immediately see much longer arms than those of a human. From what I can discern, the shorter the legs and the longer the arms, when walking upright, the more the arms need to be used for balance. The faster the bipedal walking rate, the faster the arm swing. The further out the arm swings the more it aides in walking faster by shifting the center of gravity forwards. Arm swing is also usually in sync with the step rate. Shorter legs over a given distance must swing faster if wanting to get to cover then longer ones.

Why was she moving quickly out of the area? I think its because she was frightened. Man on a horse detaches itself and another still riding high in the saddle might be a little too much to comprehend at a moments notice. Remember that animals seeing humans on horses behave like they are all one large animal. Horse scent overriding the human allows people to hunt while riding.

I did notice one fella while I was out. He was what I'd call chunky, and I'd estimate his height around 5'5. He had what I'd call a plodding type walk, didn't so much step as drop his weight on each foot as he walked. His shoulders seemed to swing quite a bit, and he had a pretty good arm swing.

Ok, I did a bit of checking. Rick mentions that Patty seemed to be rushing. Using a digital metronome I measured Patty's steps at about 80 steps per minute. I then checked mine own gait, and I'm around 100, maybe a tiny bit less.
I had my wife watch me walk and at Patty's gait of around 80 stm (steps per minute) my arms swung alot less than they did when I walked at my normal gait of around 100 stm.
Just for reference, I'm just a shade under 5'11 and I weight around 225.
A rough measurement-my inseam is around 28 inches, from crotch to bottom of my foot. My arm length is around 24 inches, from inside my armpit to the tip of my middle finger.

I guess this begs the question then, is the subjects arms longer than it's legs? or more like your own? Did you try to keep your legs from fully extending?

No, I didn't keep them from fully extending. I was going with the idea that it is a guy in a suit and why the exaggerated arm swing.
I had my wife watch the P/G a few times and then watch me walk. Overall she said that the subjects hands came closer to the knees than mine did. So, I guess that means either its arms are longer than mine, or its thighs are shorter.
Im not sure what to make of all this honestly.

It still comes back to the original question, if it is a guy in a suit, why the exaggerated arms swing?
Thats another point I can add to my thought that the P/G film depicts an actual animal.
1. Why add breasts? Isn't that an added detail that could only unravel the whole thing? It would be like hoaxing a video of Nessie and adding wings. Besides, who would think to add breasts and why?
2. Why the exaggerated arm swing? Did Patterson think ahead enough to ask the fella in the suit to swing his arms more than usual to help portray some sort of mass and size that wasn't there?
3. I honestly believe that if the folks here on this board were presented with a picture of Peter Mayhew as Chewbacca from 1977, they'd be able to pick it apart and come to the conclusion that it is in fact a guy in a suit. And the P/G film was ten years earlier.
4. With the computer technology available today, why cant someone conclusively dismiss the P/G footage? Find a zipper, or a seam in the film somewhere?
5. Remember the Sonoma video? How long did it take for folks here to dismiss THAT as a hoax? A day? Two?

It's an interesting movement for the creature to get up from the (alleged) crouch and start walking away with the strange gait and the (maybe) exaggerated arm swing.

It could be that such an arm swing has a pendulum-like nature. A semi-relaxed arm plus a bit of a plodding gait with wide shoulders and you get an arm swing with a natural periodicity of motion.

FYI, here's an interesting site linked elsewhere here, in the forums, but worth repeating, showing male-to-female human locomotion using motion capture:

http://biomotionlab.ca/Demos/BMLgender.html

But to digress for a second...if -you- were the "director" of the PG-film (assuming for a moment it's a mime-in-a-suit), how would you direct the action? Obviously there are a lot of constraints. You can't ask (or get) anything a human couldn't do, such as a large jump, a very speedy run, or a reversion to all-fours loping (to depict escape, say). But, if you consider, what is the benefit of a real creature having arms longer than legs? It would be that, in a pinch, they could revert to all fours loping. (knuckle running, like great apes?). Some of the Hollywood productions tried to get their mimes to reproduce their apes perambulating on all fours, iirc, but it's very difficult to pull off for a human, with their relatively short arms.

What the creature does, fully out in the open, (again, assuming a mime) is quite genius. By not having anything more than walking away, it really limits the cues. However, as I suggested before, it seems to require a much more robust 'suit' to allow a convincing look back in the open.

Anyway, yes it does seem like a lot of arm swing, but it doesn't seem to reach the point of looking unnatural, imo. It seems to most enable a strong forward stride. With the arms swing it urges to the torso to a slight forward lean, allowing driving forward. With no arm swing, the torso may start to lean back, slowing forward striving.

Could it be that an arm swing allows a longer stride length?

Have you ever walked fast? It's part of the natural movement, greater stride, greater swing. Your arms work to offset the the legs, the imbalance that is caused. Walk a line, on a board. To keep from falling to the side you may extend you arms outward for balance. Same thing for walking except your maintaining your balance as you just move forward. .

With all the technology available today why can't someone make a BF suit convincing enough to fool the discerning eye? If it can't be done today what clear-thinking person would conclude it could have been done 42 years ago.

I'm still waiting to see someone in a suit today, with a compliant gait, stepping 41", that closely resembles Patty. Perhaps someone can direct me to a convincing video I've missed.

This is pretty convincing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMPmMJeEoqY

Just some screen captures from the video link posted above. I tried to size them closely.



First is allegedly BH in his suit, second a still from the PG-film, last one frame from BH recreating the walk.

Note that BH's trailing foot bottom is visible, but is not lifted up above the ground. The knee bend angle for both of BH's images is about 62-65 degrees, not 86-87 degrees as in the PG-creature.





(note, again, the kick up of the trailing foot is not related to stepping over an obstacle. That is achieved by lifting the front leg higher and has no effect which would cause a 'kick up' of the trailing foot. We only see this in running or in the front leg of certain four-legged mammals walking. Even in 'marching' you don't see an exaggerated kick up of the trailing leg. The knee up of the forward leg is the only differing feature from normal walking.)