Its frequently stated that the Patterson Gimlin Film is a hoax and not a very good one at that. I'm of the opinion that its a great hoax, the hoax of hoaxes so to speak. The bad hoax proponents maintain that stuff like the PGF could be cranked out easily, cheaply by a realitively unskilled hoaxer/hoaxers. I've posted this thread not as a debate of Patterson Gimlin, but as a disscussion pertaining to the complete absence of a decent hoax. I don't consider any of the also ran films like Memorial Day and Freeman to be good hoaxes. Memorial Day I don't even consider to be even an intentional hoax just a misidentification of a human hoaxing the filmers who bought the idea that they had somehow filmed a Sasquatach.

Patty Film, mho, not a hoax, not proven to be a hoax
Memorial Day: Definate hoax and not a good one.

Remember, that the PGF had more than just the film,

1. it had the benefit of being the first, that I know of, publicized Bigfoot film hoax
2. it had the benefit of having a charismatic cowboy going on TV shows and to theaters, looking you in the eye and telling you it was real.
3. It had approx. 20 years before means of the General public scrutinizing it were in place, so the impression for 20 years to some people was that it was genuine.
4. It had the advantage of control, in other words, parts of the film are missing, original is not available for examination. Today, if someone posts a photo, experts can usually tell if it was altered, I don't know if posting a digital video on the internet causes it to lose quality, but a 3rd gen. copy of a film, does lose quality from the original.

Where was it proven to be a hoax?

I would offer that a hoax that fools a person was a great hoax to that person.

Well I would pity the fool.......

I would offer that the parameters of the opening post, which Crow says 'my opinion is that it's a hoax' means that we are to assume for the sake of argument that it is THE ONE GREAT HOAX. Assuming it is a hoax for the sake of argument. That's how I read it.

My belief doesn't need to be part of the equation

For the record, I consider the PGF to represent a really great hoax. It was orchestrated by a talented man with a singular focus to produce a convincing bigfoot on film. This was not the work of teenagers pulling a prank or some jackass trying to direct people to his lame website.

There have been great hoaxes in other areas such as Deloy's Ape and Piltdown Man. Would the ICE man count?

The thing about great hoaxes is that until they are proven to be a hoax, they are seen as the best evidence yet.

Don't forget the recent "UNDISCOVERED AMAZON TRIBE" being proven to be a hoax, and the Tasaday Tribe of the Phillipines from the 70's which even had a National Geographic article printed about it.

Hi

I thought the Amazon Tribe was a real Tribe, It was just not an undiscovered Tribe ?

Peace
Tim

Hi

How about the 911 Call, I don't think anyone has proven what is all about yet, Man i love this one

http://www.bigfootsounds.com/call911.mp3


Peace
Tim

I think the 911 call is a clasic. You can hear the stress in the guys voice,and his reluctance to say "Bigfoot" for fear that law enforcement won't show up.

Hoax:
–noun 1. something intended to deceive or defraud: The Piltdown man was a scientific hoax.
–verb (used with object) 2. to deceive by a hoax; hoodwink.

I am not convinced that PGF if a hoax. If it is, it is one of the greatest in history. The hoax has detail that was well beyond what was necessary at the time of the film to produce a hoax. One of the striking aspects is how similar the back of patty is to a gorilla. This would have taken a bit of skill beyond putting some horsehide over some football shoulder pads. Much much better than a halloween custome. The feet would be very difficult to hoax. Look at the sylvanic video and the hoffman video. They look like real animals, but you don't see any feet. I havn't seen anything close to the PGF. On the other hand, if it is not a hoax, why has no one been able to obtain a better photo or video of bf.

I also find the 911 call convincing. Has the person who made the call and received the call ever been identified?

Yeah, but on the other hand, where was it proven to be real?

RayG

I vote for the 911 call.

In order for something to be a great hoax it would need to be very convincing to a great many people for a great period of time, probably years, and then proven without doubt that it turned out to be a hoax. It would take money, time and effort with some incentive for some type of pay-off. I don't think there is enough incentive considering what it would take to make something so convincing.

Assuming the PGF is a hoax, did Patterson have incentive, I have no idea, but there certainly was risk if he was found out.

Certainly if the PGF is ever shown beyond any doubt that it was a hoax it will go down in history as a great one. (Though some will still say it was not that great). But in my opinion no one can say they know the PGF is a hoax any more than they can state they know it is genuine.

Why create a great hoax? Even the poorest ones get plenty of attention.

Not sure, by the way, how the 911 call can be considered a "hoax" at this time.

Well now that's the thing, it hasn't EITHER way, and it's being presented here as a hoax, and burden of proof works both ways. Potential hoax, maybe. But not proven is still not proven as a hoax or as real.