I was looking at some advertisements today and I am noticing that personal high definition video cameras have not only become less expensive, but smaller as well.

At around a thousand dollars there will still not be a lot of people rushing out to buy high definition video cameras when you can get Mini DV cameras starting at around $250.

That being said, we all know that eventually new technologies go down in price. I would think that we're only 2 or 3 years away from being able to purchase decent HD video cameras for 400 or 500 bucks, and at some point all of the video cameras will be HD.

I started thinking about many of the videos that we have seen and what they would look like if HD. Would it expose obvious costumes? Whether videos are credible or hoaxes, a lot more detail would be able to be seen. I would think that the number of those attempting to make hoaxed videos would drop sharply. The subjects of such videos as the Sylvanic videos are close enough to the camera where I would think it would be a yes or no clarity as to whether it was real or a hoax.

Also, I would think that if you are someone like Tom Biscardi or Todd Standing why not put your money where your mouth is? Why are they not using HD video cameras to make their films? Certainly a thousand dollars is little to invest if you are claiming to be able to easily find BF whenever you choose. Is it because they are counting on their videos being grainy, cloudy and low in resolution? I think so.

I'm NOT a computer guru by any means. However, I'm afraid the availability of computer 'hardware' to fake video images will get worse. I don't know if there's some way to "debunk" a faked CGI image or video or not.

Seen DOGFIGHTS on The History Channel lately? 'Nuff said.

-Allan, aka RocKiteman
N.E. North Carolina, USA

I just got an HD video camera and was surprised at how poor the video quality was. If P&G had been in Bluff Creek today with my video camera instead of their film camera, the PGF would be a lot less valuable! Consumer grade stuff isn't what they use on the Discovery Channel, thats for sure!

Bipto, is yours a HD DVD recorder? I've been shopping for a DVD camcorder and am seriously looking at Sony. But, for the price of these babies, it better be good.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?sk...mprd71900050008

It also seems the better the camera's get the better the hoaxers get. What passed for possible footage or pictures in the late 1800's to early 1900's wouldn't stand a chance today. The picture below is if the Cottingley Fairies taken in 1917 and believed to be an actual photograph of fairies for years. It wasn't until 1983 when the now elderly women who were the girls in the original photograph came forward and confessed that one of them were gifted in art and had hand drawn the fairies.

Click to view attachment

And today we end up with pictures like this...

Click to view attachment

which are much harder to discern as probable hoaxes, or faked in one way or another.

Plus guys you got to realize just because it's available doesn't mean everyone is going to run out and buy one and besides just because they make digital cameras that are cheap doesn't mean they work well these affordable digital cameras that your talking about how cheap are they and how many pixels do they have.

if you don't mind, what kind of camera did you get? just curious. i work with cameras daily and was somewhat surprised by your post.

Those dogfights can take weeks even months to create, and then they still look like you're in a video game. don't get me wrong, its amazing, but they are extremely complicated to make and not something most people toy around with in their spare time.

As good as it is it still looks CGI but is getting more anfd more real

We're just going to have high definition hoaxes.

bipto -

What were you watching it on? What cables were you using? Did you allow the camera to use autogain? Is it progressive or interlaced? Did you do any editing? Did you select in the camera menu to down convert HD to SD? Is it a 720 or 1080 camera? You know they are coming out with a 3800p camera this year. It should be exatcly the same as 35mm film, resolution wise. What is the chip size in the camera... please don't say it is a CMOS camera.

HD cameras have to be used with a large monitor otherwise you are litterally shooting in the dark with it. I picked up a widescreen Hitashi monitor with a gazillion cable hookups. It is a flatscreen 26" by 12" rotatable monitor with TV hookups as well for $300. Only AC though.

Never use an HD camera with Autogain on. This will allow the camera to adjust on the fly the gain so that when you pan from dark to light areas, the dark get scintillation noise patterns.

If you shoot in progressive you want to view in progressive. Same with interlaced. If you put the video on an editing time line the the settings for that time line are not the same as the cameras you will have big problems including much rendering for every little thing you do to it.

Some cameras allow downconverting so that it can be viewed on a non HD monitor or laptop. The setting is in the camera menu.

"Is it because they are counting on their videos being grainy, cloudy and low in resolution? I think so"

I agree

Yes if they are not that much clearer or resolute than what you get out of today's Mini DV video cameras then I will be very disappointed.

In all honesty I have never used one of the HD video cameras but was just assuming from watching HD programming. I only recently switched to an HD tv and purchased the HD satellite package. The first night I had it I was watching a basketball game in HD on TNT. After you get used to watching it sometimes it just seems like a really good picture. But for giggles I switched for a second from the HD channel to a regular channel that was showing the same game. It seemed as if I was watching the game on a 30 year old set thru a dirty milk glass, it was horrible compared to the HD, and I always thought I had a good picture. I was watching something on the Discovery Channel in HD and there was a woman on the screen. The pictures was so sharp that I could make out the lines where the make up on her face began, and could see the fine hairs on her neck.

I was hoping that these new video cameras would at least approach that kind of clearity.

The thing is that with a consumer grade HD camera you probably wont get the very best clarity, but they are still much better then your average hand held SD mini DV. Lately panasonic has been making some pretty good cameras at a more affordable price. i toyed around with one in a store and was pretty impressed. the zoom was incredible. i was able to read the label on a box about 150 yards away across the store. As far as the picture quality, i had no complaints. looked like it was far better then that of the normal SD handhelds. i think it gives you a lot of bang for your buck. check it out.

http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/store...000000000005702

Now, if you want that clarity that your getting from the discovery channel or other HD programs. check this one out. A lot of studios have actually started to use this camera to shoot alot of their smaller films or projects like music videos. check it out.

http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/s...Model=AG-HVX200

i'm actually on the verge of purchasing this for my work. maybe i'll get a chance to take it out to the woods and mess around with it.

I've watched it both on my 50" 1080p screen and my 27-ish" 720i screen, both using an HDMI cable. Not sure what autogain is, so it may be using it. I'll have to look in the menus. The camera is 1080i and I have not done much editing. Just a little. It's less than a month old. And yes, I'm afraid it's a CMOS camera (it says so rather proudly right there on the side). A Sony HDR-HC5, to be exact.

I wasn't even in the market for an video camera until my wife went overseas at the same time my daughter was scheduled to have a dance recital and my son was set to play his first little league game and upon pulling out the old camera I discovered it had stopped working (it records sound, but no picture). So I was in kind of rush and didn't want to spend more than $1k.

I decided against the DVD recordable since my computer had a slot-loading DVD drive. Those little disks would get caught and never come out again.

This is the one I got.

Hi,

The cheap HD cams, are usualy HDV camcorders. HDV has many disadvantages. The real good HD footage comes from much less compressed formats, and what is even more importent, is that it is very difficult to get something in focus. As the resolution is higher you usualy should use a external referenz monitor, or a highend viewfinder. It is generally harder to get good CGI in HD formats. This is due the fact, that on SD you could usualy blure the CGI image (second class or worse) a little, and so make it more realistic. If you want a CGI to match in focus HD, the last pixel generated must be 100%. But good CGI artists are used to high quality, since 35mm (2k and grain) is even harder to match.

I don´t think that HD will change much regarding BF footage. The most importent points still are to get the subject in focus, and the ability to zoom in.

@damndirtyape
Regarding 3800p, are you talking about the RED?

Yeah, good luck getting your hands on one of those babies before the next ice age...

Regarding the CGI in HD, data's post matches what (little) I know about it. For example, I'm a huge fan of the new Doctor Who and it's not shot in HD, which is very annoying. The producers have said they don't shoot HD due to the number of effects shots in their production. If they shot HD, it'd take them two or three times longer to make and it would be about that much more expensive.

I'm waiting until the little hard drive based cameras are affordable on HD - I'm fed up with using tapes

I might consider a DVD based solution though - if nothing else, just so that I have a copy of the raw footage before I start mucking about with adobe premier.

Yes

Yeah, as longs as they all agree to use an open and common format for their video. Sony, typically, has not (or, I should say, they've invented yet another "standard" all their own).

Assuming that you are recording on to a mini DV tape, the only thing that i can think of sounds like you could be recording in LP mode instead of SP. just a wild guess? that could explain the quality loss. other than that i'm at a loss. have you tried finding any reviews about the camera on the internet?
Also, if you have only had the camera for a short amount of time, take it back. I would. no point in having a camera that you dont ever want to use cause it doesn't perform the way it should.

and that is why sony is slowly falling off the grid. the quality of their cameras are getting worse and in general, the company seems to be becoming less competitive with other companies on all levels everyday. hopefully the will prove me wrong.