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watch1
In my search for information on the article that I working on that is covering Bigfoot history in Alabama I ran across a very interesting article. It is long but a very interesting read.

It is mixed up with alot of other stuff and would be hard to point a direct link to it so I will paste it here.
[EDIT] to add the link... Archaeological Coverups
QUOTE
Archaeological Coverups

by David Hatcher Childress

NEXUS magazine. Most of us are familiar with the last scene in the popular Indiana Jones archaeological adventure film RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK in which an important historical artefact, the Ark of the Covenant from the Temple in Jerusalem, is locked in a crate and put in a giant warehouse, never to be seen again, thus ensuring that no history books will have to be rewritten and no history professor will have to revise the lecture that he has been giving for the last forty years.

While the film was fiction, the scene in which an important ancient relic is buried in a warehouse is uncomfortably close to reality for many researchers. To those who investigate allegations of archaeological cover-ups, there are disturbing indications that the most important archaeological institute in the United States, the Smithsonian Institute, an independent federal agency, has been actively suppressing some of the most interesting and important archaeological discoveries made in the Americas.

The Vatican has been long accused of keeping artefacts and ancient books in their vast cellars, without allowing the outside world access to them. These secret treasures, often of a controversial historical or religious nature, are allegedly suppressed by the Catholic Church because they might damage the church's credibility, or perhaps cast their official texts in doubt. Sadly, there is overwhelming evidence that something very similar is happening with the Smithsonian Institution.

The cover-up and alleged suppression of archaeological evidence began in late 1881 when John Wesley Powell, the geologist famous for exploring the Grand Canyon, appointed Cyrus Thomas as the director of the Eastern Mound Division of the Smithsonian Institution's

Bureau of Ethnology. When Thomas came to the Bureau of Ethnology he was a "pronounced believer in the existence of a race of Mound Builders, distinct from the American Indians."

However, John Wesley Powell, the director of the Bureau of Ethnology, a very sympathetic man toward the American Indians, had lived with the peaceful Winnebago Indians of Wisconsin for many years as a youth and felt that American Indians were unfairly thought of as primitive and savage. The Smithsonian began to promote the idea that Native Americans, at that time being exterminated in the Indian Wars, were descended from advanced civilizations and were worthy of respect and protection. They also began a program of suppressing any archaeological evidence that lent credence to the school of thought known as Diffusionism, a school which believes that throughout history there has been widespread dispersion of culture and civilization via contact by ship and major trade routes.

The Smithsonian opted for the opposite school, known as Isolationism. Isolationism holds that most civilizations are isolated from each other and that there has been very little contact between them, especially those that are separated by bodies of water. In this intellectual war that started in the 1880s, it was held that even contact between the civilizations of the Ohio and Mississippi Valleys were rare, and certainly these civilizations did not have any contact with such advanced cultures as the Mayas, Toltecs, or Aztecs in Mexico and Central America. By Old World standards this is an extreme, and even ridiculous idea, considering that the river system reached to the Gulf of Mexico and these civilizations were as close as the opposite shore of the gulf. It was like saying that cultures in the Black Sea area could not have had contact with the Mediterranean.

When the contents of many ancient mounds and pyramids of the Midwest were examined, it was shown that the history of the Mississippi River Valleys was that of an ancient and sophisticated culture that had been in contact with Europe and other areas. Not only that, the contents of many mounds revealed burials of huge men, sometimes seven or eight feet tall, in full armour with swords and sometimes huge treasures.

(Vangard note..>Eastern Indian texts say that at one time men lived thousands of years and grew very tall in direct proportion to their age, as does the Bible with the comment "and there were GIANTS in the earth in those days...") For instance, when Spiro Mound in Oklahoma was excavated in the 1930's, a tall man in full armour was discovered along with a pot of thousands of pearls and other artefacts, the largest such treasure so far documented. The whereabouts of the man in armour is unknown and it is quite likely that it eventually was taken to the Smithsonian Institution.

In a private conversation with a well-known historical researcher (who shall remain nameless), I was told that a former employee of the Smithsonian, who was dismissed for defending the view of diffusionism in the Americas (i.e. the heresy that other ancient civilizations may have visited the shores of North and South America during the many millennia before Columbus), alleged that the Smithsonian at one time had actually taken a barge full of unusual artefacts out into the Atlantic and dumped them in the ocean. Though the idea of the Smithsonian' covering up a valuable archaeological find is difficult to accept for some, there is, sadly, a great deal of evidence to suggest that the Smithsonian Institution has knowingly covered up and 'lost' important archaeological relics. The STONEWATCH NEWSLETTER of the Gungywamp Society in Connecticut, which researches megalithic sites in New England, had a curious story in their Winter 1992 issue about stone coffins discovered in 1892 in Alabama which were sent to the Smithsonian Institution and then 'lost'. According to the newsletter, researcher Frederick J. Pohl wrote an intriguing letter in 1950 to the late Dr. T.C. Lethbridge, a British archaeologist. The letter from Pohl stated, "A professor of geology sent me a reprint (of the) Smithsonian Institution, THE CRUMF BURIAL CAVE by Frank Burns, US Geological Survey, from the report of the US National Museum for 1892, pp 451-454, 1984. In the Crumf Cave, southern branch of the Warrior River, in Murphy's Valley, Blount County, Alabama, accessible from Mobile Bay by river, were coffins of wood hollowed out by fire, aided by stone or copper chisels. Either of these coffins were taken to the Smithsonian. They were about 7.5 feet long, 14" to 18" wide, 6" to 7" deep. Lids open. "I wrote recently to the Smithsonian, and received a reply March 11th from F.M. Setzler, Head Curator of Department of Anthropology (He said) 'We have not been able to find the specimens in our collections, though records show that they were received." David Barron, President of the Gungywamp Society was eventually told by the Smithsonian in 1992 that the coffins were actually wooden troughs and that they could not be viewed anyway because they were housed in an asbestos-contaminated warehouse. This warehouse was to be closed for the next ten years and no one was allowed in except the Smithsonian personnel!

Ivan T. Sanderson, a well-known zoologist and frequent guest on Johnny Carson's TONIGHT SHOW in the 1960s (usually with an exotic animal with a pangolin or a lemur), once related a curious story about a letter he received regarding an engineer who was stationed on the Aleutian island of Shemya during World War II. While building an airstrip, his crew bulldozed a group of hills and discovered under several sedimentary layers what appeared to be human remains. The Alaskan mound was in fact a graveyard of gigantic human remains, consisting of crania and long leg bones. The crania measured from 22 to 24 inches from base to crown. Since an adult skull normally measures about eight inches from back to front, such a large crania would imply an immense size for a normally proportioned human. Furthermore, every skull was said to have been neatly trepanned (a process of cutting a hole in the upper portion of the skull).

In fact, the habit of flattening the skull of an infant and forcing it to grow in an elongated shape was a practice used by ancient Peruvians, the Mayas, and the Flathead Indians of Montana. Sanderson tried to gather further proof, eventually receiving a letter from another member of the unit who confirmed the report. The letters both indicated that the Smithsonian Institution had collected the remains, yet nothing else was heard. Sanderson seemed convinced that the Smithsonian Institution had received the bizarre relics, but wondered why they would not release the data. He asks, "...is it that these people cannot face rewriting all the textbooks?" In 1944 an accidental discovery of an even more controversial nature was made by Waldemar Julsrud at Acambaro, Mexico. Acambaro is in the state of Guanajuato, 175 miles northwest of Mexico City. The strange archaeological site there yielded over 33,500 objects of ceramic;stone, including jade; and knives of obsidian (sharper than steel and still used today in heart surgery). Jalsrud, a prominent local German merchant, also found statues ranging from less than an inch to six feet in length depicting great reptiles, some of them in ACTIVE ASSOCIATION with humans - generally eating them, but in some bizarre statuettes an erotic association was indicated. To observers many of these creatures resembled dinosaurs. Jalsrud crammed this collection into twelve rooms of his expanded house. There startling representations of Negroes, Orientals, and bearded Caucasians were included as were motifs of Egyptians, Sumerian and other ancient non-hemispheric civilizations, as well as portrayals of Bigfoot and aquatic monsterlike creatures, weird human-animal mixtures, and a host of other inexplicable creations. Teeth from an extinct Ice Age horse, the skeleton of a mammoth, and a number of human skulls were found at the same site as the ceramic artefacts.

Radio-carbon dating in the laboratories of the University of Pennsylvania and additional tests using the thermoluminescence method of dating pottery were performed to determine the age of the objects. Results indicated the objects were made about 6,500 years ago, around 4,500 BC. A team of experts at another university, shown Jalrud's half-dozen samples but unaware of their origin, ruled out the possibility that they could have been modern reproductions. However, they fell silent when told of their controversial source. In 1952, in an effort to debunk this weird collection which was gaining a certain amount of fame, American archaeologist Charles C. DiPeso claimed to have minutely examined the then 32,000 pieces within not more than four hours spent at the home of Julsrud. In a forthcoming book, long delayed by continuing developments in his investigation, archaeological investigator John H. Tierney, who has lectured on the case for decades, points out that to have done that DiPeso would have had to have inspected 133 pieces per minute steadily for four hours, whereas in actuality, it would have required weeks merely to have separated the massive jumble of exhibits and arranged them properly for a valid evaluation. Tierney, who collaborated with the later Professor Hapgood, the late William N. Russell, and others in the investigation, charges that the Smithsonian Institution and other archaeological authorities conducted a campaign of disinformation against the discoveries. The Smithsonian had, early in the controversy, dismissed the entire Acambaro collection as an elaborate hoax. Also, utilizing the Freedom of Information Act, Tierney discovered that practically the entirety of the Smithsonian's Julsrud case files are missing. After two expeditions to the site in 1955 and 1968, Professor Charles Hapgood, a professor of history and anthropology at the University of New Hampshire, recorded the results of his 18-year investigation of Acambaro in a privately printed book entitled MYSTERY IN ACAMBARO. Hapgood was initially an open-minded skeptic concerning the collection but became a believer after his first visit in 1955, at which time he witnessed some of the figures being excavated and even dictated to the diggers where he wanted them to dig.

Adding to the mind-boggling aspects of this controversy is the fact that the Instituto Nacional de Antropologia e Historia, through the late Director of PreHispanic Monuments, Dr. Eduardo Noguera, (who, as head of an official investigating team at the site, issued a report which Tierney will be publishing), admitted "the apparent scientific legality with which these objects were found." Despite evidence of their own eyes, however, officials declared that because of the objects 'fantastic' nature, they had to have been a hoax played on Julsrud!

A disappointed but ever-hopeful Julsrud died. His house was sold and the collection put in storage. The collection is not currently open to the public.

Perhaps the most amazing suppression of all is the excavation of an Egyptian tomb by the Smithsonian itself in Arizona. A lengthy front page story of the PHOENIX GAZETTE on 5 April 1909 (follows this article), gave a highly detailed report of the discovery and excavation of a rock-cut vault by an expedition led by a Professor S.A. Jordan of the Smithsonian. The Smithsonian, however, claims to have absolutely no knowledge of the discovery or its discoverers. The World Explorers Club decided to check on this story by calling the Smithsonian in Washington, D.C., though we felt there was little chance of getting any real information. After speaking briefly to an operator, we were transferred to a Smithsonian staff archaeologist, and a woman's voice came on the phone and identified herself.

I told her that I was investigating a story from a 1909 Phoenix newspaper article about the Smithsonian Institution's having excavated rock-cut vaults in the Grand Canyon where Egyptian artefacts had been discovered, and whether the Smithsonian Institution could give me any more information on the subject. "Well, the first thing I can tell you, before we go any further," she said, "is that no Egyptian artefacts of any kind have ever been found in North or South America. Therefore, I can tell you that the Smithsonian Institute has never been involved in any such excavations." She was quite helpful and polite but, in the end, knew nothing. Neither she nor anyone else with whom I spoke could find any record of the discovery or either G.E. Kinkaid and Professor S.A. Jordan.

While it cannot be discounted that the entire story is an elaborate newspaper hoax, the fact that it was on the front page, named the prestigious Smithsonian Institution, and gave a highly detailed story that went on for several pages, lends a great deal to its credibility. It is hard to believe such a story could have come out of thin air.

Is the Smithsonian Institution covering up an archaeological discovery of immense importance? If this story is true it would radically change the current view that there was no transoceanic contact in pre-Columbian times, and that all American Indians, on both continents, are descended from Ice Age explorers who came across the Bering Strait. (Any information on G.E. Kinkaid and Professor S.A. Jordan, or their alleged discoveries, that readers may have would be greatly appreciated.....write to Childress at the World Explorers Club at the above address.)

Is the idea that ancient Egyptians came to the Arizona area in the ancient past so objectionable and preposterous that it must be covered up? Perhaps the Smithsonian Institution is more interested in maintaining the status quo than rocking the boat with astonishing new discoveries that overturn previously accepted academic teachings.

Historian and linguist Carl Hart, editor of WORLD EXPLORER, then obtained a hiker's map of the Grand Canyon from a bookstore in Chicago. Poring over the map, we were amazed to see that much of the area on the north side of the canyon has Egyptian names. The area around Ninety-four Mile Creek and Trinity Creek had areas (rock formations, apparently) with names like Tower of Set, Tower of Ra, Horus Temple, Osiris Temple, and Isis Temple. In the Haunted Canyon area were such names as the Cheops Pyramid, the Buddha Cloister, Buddha Temple, Manu Temple and Shiva Temple. Was there any relationship between these places and the alleged Egyptian discoveries in the Grand Canyon?

We called a state archaeologist at the Grand Canyon, and were told that the early explorers had just liked Egyptian and Hindu names, but that it was true that this area was off limits to hikers or other visitors, "because of dangerous caves."

Indeed, this entire area with the Egyptian and Hindu place names in the Grand Canyon is a forbidden zone - no one is allowed into this large area.

We could only conclude that this was the area where the vaults were located. Yet today, this area is curiously off-limits to all hikers and even, in large part, park personnel.

I believe that the discerning reader will see that if only a small part of the "Smithsoniangate" evidence is true, then our most hallowed archaeological institution has been actively involved in suppressing evidence for advanced American cultures, evidence for ancient voyages of various cultures to North America, evidence for anomalistic giants and other oddball artefacts, and evidence that tends to disprove the official dogma that is now the history of North America.

The Smithsonian's Board of Regents still refuses to open its meetings to the news media or the public. If Americans were ever allowed inside the 'nation's attic', as the Smithsonian has been called, what skeletons might they find?
How about that? I found the part about ***about stone coffins discovered in 1892 in Alabama which were sent to the Smithsonian Institution and then 'lost'. *** very interesting.

Mike (watch1)
komodoman
I remember reading something about a secluded military base, that had Bigfoot activity around it, even capturing creatures on surveillance cameras. I think there's a big possibility authorities could be aware, and not admit it.
PEPPERSFARMS
I read much on this in other articles and it is fascinating to me. I’ve recently saw an article on a elaborate tunnel system in Mexico with Egyptian carvings on the tunnels. I don’t remember much about it maybe a GOOGLE will turn up something. :popcorn2:

Thanks Watch1 a good post!!! :new_thumbsupsmileyanim:
RayG
Cool, what University is Childress working out of?

RayG
watch1
QUOTE(RayG @ Aug 28 2006, 03:44 PM) *
Cool, what University is Childress working out of?

RayG


LOL

If he was working out of a University, how long do you think he would have his job?

This is not the first time articles like this have come up. I know we have those that are way out there but I thought this was an interesting read.
There was a time that these discoveries were printed in the papers and scientific articles. Why do we not hear about these now.

The Readers Digest did works on alot of these articles at one time. Discoveries all over North America.

Here is a little more about the article.

LINK

Its' like finding footprints in stone..you have to form your own opinion.

Mike (watch1)
Angie
Good post.

Yeah, I read about the Smithsonian coverups concerning the Mound people a few years back..Even posted it on here somewhere.

I totally believe its true.

I know people like to accuse us conspiracy believers of being a little "off" or "extreme" but oh well. I tell it like I see it.

Let me put it like this: You see a BF. You know they exist. You live in a world where technology is advanced. A world where history has and is being recorded.....Somebody, (important even) other than you, knows that they exist as well.

Add on to that, the info and articles that you read, like the one mentioned above and it would only take a very stupid man (or woman) to say that there are no conspiracies or coverups....Sorry but I've had the wool pulled over my eyes long enough. I've been slapped in the face with reality.

I could go on for days about the betrayal that I feel from several different authorities but I wont. Its just something I live and learn by. I just wish everyone else knew too. It's an injustice that is being continued even to this day. A wrong that needs to be righted......

Oh, dang...Something that people should realize, I dont think its been pointed out. A Bf witness, on top of all the other emotions that we feel, we also feel helplessness. I cant prove a damn thing and I cant right all the wrongs that have been dealt to us as a human race.

Sorry, was just reading another thread, the one that Huntster started about Witnesses having to prove our claims.....Like he said, I dont give a rats-arse if you believe me or not.....at least I wish I didnt :doh:

Angie
billgreen2005bigfoot
hey everyone like i said before our goverment etc knows about sasquatch creatures but they probley dont see them as threat to our security etc. but maybe the goverment is curious about sasquatch creatures unofficialy of course. keep me posted. bill
Ionfreeze
Ive read several stories of ancient Egyptian items being found in caves in the Grand Canyon. From what I understand the caves are very difficult to reach. The entrance is actually located on Indian Reservation land that borders the Grand Canyon. But the government claims them as part of the Grand Canyon. These caves are actually hallways and rooms carved from rock. Reportedly, many artifacts were discovered and shipped to the Smithsonian and then later dumped into the Atlantic.

Theres another ancient Egyptian site somewhere in Australia. Its believed to be a burial site for an important person. Of course archeologist refuse to accept the obvious statting that Egyptians from that time ( around 4000 BC ) lacked the knowledge and ships building skills to make such long journeys. But, they then claim that the Egyptians had advanced knowledge of astronomy to build the pyramids. Ummm ok. A few years ago archeologists discovered a large ship buried in the sand near the pyramids. They stated that the ship was cerimonial and not considered sea worthy. Shortly after that, several more of the ships were unearthed. All of them were found to be constructed to survive in the open ocean.

As long as universities keep teaching theyre current historical time line we will never really understand our history. Its simple, archeologist believe they already have a historical time line of what has happened and when and where it happened. Anything that doesnt "fit" into that time line is discarded as improbable or a hoax.

But dont take my word for it. Do your own research. You can google ancient egyptians and get a ton of material to read through . :happy:

Ionfreeze
Ionfreeze
I did a google search and found the following links:

Egyptians in the Grand Canyon.

http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/text/0000tx09x.html

http://www.philipcoppens.com/egyptiancanyon.html

Egyptians in Australia.

http://www.crystalinks.com/egyptaustralia.html

http://www.subversiveelement.com/History_A...roglyphics.html

Also you can check out the Australia version of Bigfoot.

http://www.yowiehunters.com/

Yes I know, Ive got to much time on my hands.

Ionfreeze

I am not an Egyptologist.
I am not a Bigfoot Expert.
I am not an archeologist.
But I did spend the night at a Holiday Inn Express last night!
Huntster
QUOTE(billgreen2005bigfoot @ Aug 29 2006, 05:33 AM) *
hey everyone like i said before our goverment etc knows about sasquatch creatures but they probley dont see them as threat to our security etc.


That's a good point. I can understand why the Air Force was interested enough in the UFO phenomenon to actually fund studies. Security was an issue.

But by the same token, other government agencies or groups should be interested enough in sasquatchery to at least fund some research or response.

Like, how about these guys?

QUOTE
...but maybe the goverment is curious about sasquatch creatures unofficialy of course....


That may very well be the case.

In fact, I'll bet it is.
Saskeptic
So lemme get this straight. The "government" doesn't like the idea of widely sea-faring Egyptians so they intentionally dumped a barge-load of priceless artefatcs into the ocean so they'll "never be found?" (It's a good thing we never find anything of value under water!) Are all governments in on this, or just the one that presides over this open and democratic society? And the reason for this vast conspiracy is . . .

. . . to keep researchers from writing new textbooks, which they do all the time anyway?

Sorry folks, i don't see how my world view changes if Egyptians explored the Grand Canyon, other than to think that the Egyptians were even cooler than I thought they were.

I like a good anti-government conspiracy as much as the next guy, but I'm gonna a need a little better "probable cause" than an unwillingness to write new textbooks. Just because some guy at the Smithsonian can't locate something in their archives doesn't mean we're all being duped. It could just mean that they've got a lot of stuff and it isn't always that easy to find a particular item.
watch1
You have no idea.

Control religion, education and economics and you control the world.

Sometimes I feel like I am getting used..how about you? Think about it when you fill up your car with gas based on Middle east oil prices when I know of wells right here that have been drilled and capped. Refineries that were bought out and then shutdown.

Oh sorry..that don't have a thing to do with Bigfoot.

Focus..focus..

Mike (watch1)
Saskeptic
QUOTE(watch1 @ Aug 29 2006, 02:25 PM) *
Control religion, education and economics and you control the world.



I'm with you there, but I don't see how covering up evidence of Egyptian explorations or the contents of burial mounds grants anyone control of "religion, education, and economics."

I fantasize about my own totalitarian regime all the time, but "guarded secrets at the Smithsonian" doesn't even make my "top 500" list of how i might get there.
ljromero76
c'mon peeps, open your eyes,
i'm willing to bet $$$, the gov't has an bf some where.....
Dillrod
I worked at a base for almost eight years that was responsible for UFO sightings, Killer bees, Submarine refueling, "50 miles inland", and al l sorts of other crap. I had access to everywhere and there was absolutely NOTHING to support any of the media reports!!!!! So be very careful of Tabloid science / stories.
watch1
I worked at a place one time that I couldn't go in the room next door. Why? Because I didn't have the need to know. Things get real exciting when you turn around and you have four 45s pointed in your direction because somebody forgot to turn the damn alarm off. 6 years in the place was all I could stand because of the pressure.
That and the fact that it was cold up there in MA. and they only have about 4 weeks of summer..LOL
Got out ..came home ..got in the National Guard ..unit got activated..sent the Gulf War 1 and didn't have to worry about the cold anymore.

Isn't life fun!


Mike (watch1)
HarryHenderson
QUOTE(Saskeptic @ Aug 29 2006, 01:43 PM) *
I'm with you there, but I don't see how covering up evidence of Egyptian explorations or the contents of burial mounds grants anyone control of "religion, education, and economics.".....
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, the context in which this was presented is in the Smithsonian re-writing history in order to further some 'mysterious' agenda. I will assume that in some purists' opinions, that is an egregious infraction. The capacity for an entity like the Smithsonian to perpetrate such a ruse should never be underestimated. They not only house history, they are allowed to disseminate it (or not) at will. And who knows if this is all true or not anyway, but it is certainly plausible and not exempt from being possibly true. IMHO.

"Harry"
MYM
Ya know as crazy as it sounds I have a tendency to belive stuff like has more turth to it than any of us would proabbly care to admit-or know. History and religion are like twins that just walk different paths at different points and much like there are those in power who gain by controlling religious belief there are those who profit either monetarily or in some other ways I dont even want to contemplate by controlling what we knoiw as 'history'. What we know really is just the sum total of what we read or what we were taught and all that knowledge is just spoon fed from one generation to the next. Sometimes I believe the history of this earth of ours is radically different than what we know but like everyone else I'm too busy supporting the family, paying bills and whittling away the days at work to really to pay these thoughts any real mind. And I am mostly happy with that no doubt about it. There does seem to be many things that don;t seem to quite fit though but we have been taught to pound the square peg into the round hole for so long that the gaps in between the edges seem pretty damn acceptable and convenient to crazy theroies like Bigfoot on one end and even crazier concepts like spontaneous evolutionary development on the other. But then again I belive in Bigfoot and the Red Sox' Five Year Plan so I may very well just be insane and not know it :laugh:
RayG
QUOTE(watch1 @ Aug 29 2006, 06:30 PM) *
I worked at a place one time that I couldn't go in the room next door. Why? Because I didn't have the need to know.


Heh, having the need to know, I used to work in a room like that. No bigfoot in there though, just national security stuff. new_specool.gif

RayG
LaurieB2851
QUOTE(HarryHenderson @ Aug 29 2006, 07:09 PM) *
QUOTE(Saskeptic @ Aug 29 2006, 01:43 PM) *
I'm with you there, but I don't see how covering up evidence of Egyptian explorations or the contents of burial mounds grants anyone control of "religion, education, and economics.".....
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, the context in which this was presented is in the Smithsonian re-writing history in order to further some 'mysterious' agenda. I will assume that in some purists' opinions, that is an egregious infraction. The capacity for an entity like the Smithsonian to perpetrate such a ruse should never be underestimated. They not only house history, they are allowed to disseminate it (or not) at will. And who knows if this is all true or not anyway, but it is certainly plausible and not exempt from being possibly true. IMHO.

"Harry"


Hi Harry!

I'm with you. I keep thinking of something I read one time (and I can't remember where, sorry - probably a television program regarding UFO's), that President Bush, Sr. was asked about UFO's one time and his response was, "You don't know the half of it." Now if that was a truthful event with Bush, Sr., then anything else is possible to cover up, IMHO. I don't think history books come into anything as far as concerns of having to rewrite history, but just think - if anything Egyptian discovered implied that perhaps Egyptians were here first - with the mess in the middle east being what it is - how would that be perceived by those who are fanatics? If facts like that are being hidden from the American people, or any of the world's people for that matter - that would not sit well with me. I would LOVE to know some of that stuff. There really might be some good reasons not to though. I'm just speculating cause we sure can't prove it.
BeansBaxter
I am shocked and dismayed at this thread.....to think that any of you would think the governmet would lie to us??!!?? We all know how hard our elected officials work to keep things honest and truthfull.

Can't believe in this day and age there are people who don't trust the government (shakes head in disbelief)


(In case you don't recognize it 99% of this reply is sarcasm)
LaurieB2851
Saskeptic says:

QUOTE
I'm with you there, but I don't see how covering up evidence of Egyptian explorations or the contents of burial mounds grants anyone control of "religion, education, and economics."


For whatever reason, we might be positively flabergasted at how much is hidden behind closed doors that never see the light of day. I get real disgusted when I hear something was turned over to a museum years ago and gets lost. How does someone lose important info like that? Yes, I know there is staff turnover, etc., but places like museums are supposed to be the custodians of our history - what kind of custodian of anything history loses stuff? There is no good answer to that question of course, but 8 foot tall skeletons (as an example) - how do you lose something like that? Or is it in fact lost? That's the thing - we can't understand that kind of irresponsibility.
PEPPERSFARMS
QUOTE(BeansBaxter @ Aug 29 2006, 09:57 PM) *
I am shocked and dismayed at this thread.....to think that any of you would think the governmet would lie to us??!!?? We all know how hard our elected officials work to keep things honest and truthfull.

Can't believe in this day and age there are people who don't trust the government (shakes head in disbelief)


(In case you don't recognize it 99% of this reply is sarcasm)


I'm from the government and I'm here to HELP YOU!!!!!

huh.gif huh.gif huh.gif wacko.gif wacko.gif wacko.gif :new_lmaosmiley: :new_lmaosmiley:
watch1
This is being discussed in...the Little People....thread and sorry for cross posting , but thought it might be interesting over here also. Seems I never read anything about this in my American History class.

*****
A Pygmie Graveyard in Tennessee

from Ancient Man: A Handbook of Puzzling Artifacts, William R Corliss, Sourcebook Project, 1978.

Anthropological Institute, Journal, 6:100, 1876.

An ancient graveyard of vast proportions has been found in Coffee county. It is similiar to those found in White county and other places in middle Tennessee, but is vastly more extensive, and shows that the race of pygmies who once inhabited this country were very numerous. The same peculiarities of position Observed in the White county graves are found in these. The writer of the letter says: "Some considerable excitement and curiousity took place a few days since, near Hillsboro, Coffee county, on James Brown's farm. A man was ploughing in a field which had been cultivated many years, and ploughed up a man's skull and other bones. After making further examination they found that there were about six acres in the graveyard. They were buried in a sitting or standing position. The bones show that they were a dwarf tribe of people, about three feet high. It is estimated that there were about 75,000 to 100,000 buried there. This shows that this country was inhabited hundreds of years ago."

*****

Anyone in that area that could tell us a little more about this?

Mike (watch1)
Paul1968UK
QUOTE(LaurieB2851 @ Aug 30 2006, 02:47 AM) *
I'm with you. I keep thinking of something I read one time (and I can't remember where, sorry - probably a television program regarding UFO's), that President Bush, Sr. was asked about UFO's one time and his response was, "You don't know the half of it."


A similar event occurred when President Reagan got a private viewing of 'ET' at the Whitehouse. He is said to have leaned over to Speilburg and whispered 'you don't realise how close you are'.

It may be apocryphal, but I like it smile.gif
OhioBF
The cover-up that I want to know about is the moon. I believe that we did go to the moon, but there are reports that astrounts saw large spaceships and bases on the far side of the moon.

I have never bought into the reason why the far side of the moon never faces earth. In a random universe, to have our moon rotate so perfectly that we only get to see one side of it just doesn't seem random.
OnlyASize12
I admit to getting a little disbelieving when folks start with "there is a government coverup of bigfoot".

Yes, it is possible. Dang near anything is possible. But how likely is it...? Very low as I see things.

I believe that the US military and intelligence services can conceal things for very long periods of time without leaks. It is more than that they can threaten people, is also has a lot to do with what they are concealing. Reading history books about organizations that keep secrets shows that security does get kept when people believe that there is a real need for it. And when the number of people keeping the secret is small. The more massive the conspiracy, the more unlikely it is - to me - to be real. The larger the group of people keeping the secret is... the more likely someone somewhere is gonna slip. I believe you can keep secret something like that there is a spy working within the Kremlin passing secrets out to the US.
Probably only a dozens or so people would know that and anyone with access to that information can immediately see how important the need to keep it secret is.

It is another issue to say that EPA or that state environmental agencies know about Bigfoot and are keeping it secret so that something like lumber concerns are not harmed.

I work for a state environmental agency. There is no secrecy paperwork to sign. Information that the appointed officials really don't want released gets leaked all the time by people who feel that they are responsible to the taxpayers. Doing this is not really any great danger. As someone covered by the civil service acts (which most state and federal employees would be) there is not a whole lot that can be done - even if there is proof that you were the "deep throat" who leaked information to the press. They can yell at you and pass you over for promotions...but they would really have to work at it (and basically lie) to get reason to fire you. Most political appointees are gone too soon to deal with that sort of stuff.

I'm not real sure big conspiracy buffs actually have conception of just how pathetic real government agencies are. We are a lot closer to Dilbert than not. Most agencies are doing really good to simply get done those things that they are charged with, let alone conspire to hide the existence of something like Bigfoot.

As for the Smithsonian... I've heard it described as the nation's attic. Boxes and boxes and boxes and boxes and boxes of stuff. Ever lose something? In your own home? Spent weeks looking for it? And that was something you knew you were missing. What about that thing you don't even know is missing yet...because you haven't tried to look for it... because your spouse bought it and brought it home and put it away? The fact that the Smithsonian lost track of something isn't by itself grounds for conspiracy to me. Things do get lost. You've got to figure with a large enough list of items and so many people involved, the odds of a random screwup misfiling something will catch up with you.

As for Smithsonian dumping things to keep text-books from being rewritten....I admit to finding that a bit weak. I could believe - with proof - that evidence contrary to someone's beliefs has been destroyed. Things like this have happened in archeology and science before, it will happen again. But whole sale "lets take all this stuff out to see and dump it so there is no more evidence here" seems a bit much.
Huntster
QUOTE(HarryHenderson @ Aug 29 2006, 06:09 PM) *
QUOTE(Saskeptic @ Aug 29 2006, 01:43 PM) *
I'm with you there, but I don't see how covering up evidence of Egyptian explorations or the contents of burial mounds grants anyone control of "religion, education, and economics.".....
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, the context in which this was presented is in the Smithsonian re-writing history in order to further some 'mysterious' agenda....


I didn't read it that way. I interpreted it as the Smithsonian (with the assistance of the National Park Service) hiding evidence that would re-write the history that the Smithsonian has already bought in to.

I don't believe it for a second, but I do believe there is a possibility that some form of ancient Native American heirogliphics that might resemble Egyptian can be found along the rim of the Grand Canyon, and the Park Service has placed the area off limits in order to protect it from human scavengers and vandals.
clownboy
This has got to be the most interesting post here in months. Even though any Bigfoot relation is very remote and the whole cover up thing is bizarre to say the least, I find myself deeply interested in how these things came to be. It reminds me of a book I read called "Vallhala Rising" about Vikings coming to the new world hundreds of years before Columbus and leaving their artifacts behind. Thanks for the great post and I look forward to any serious additions anyone can add.
HarryHenderson
QUOTE(Huntster @ Aug 30 2006, 09:01 AM) *
QUOTE(HarryHenderson @ Aug 29 2006, 06:09 PM) *

QUOTE(Saskeptic @ Aug 29 2006, 01:43 PM) *
I'm with you there, but I don't see how covering up evidence of Egyptian explorations or the contents of burial mounds grants anyone control of "religion, education, and economics.".....
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, the context in which this was presented is in the Smithsonian re-writing history in order to further some 'mysterious' agenda....
I didn't read it that way. I interpreted it as the Smithsonian (with the assistance of the National Park Service) hiding evidence that would re-write the history that the Smithsonian has already bought in to......
And you're right, that is in fact how I actually meant it, even if it didn't quite come out that way. :smile: Although, since this supposedly transpired many years ago, it could be said they've since re-written it if any of it is in fact true. :wink:

"Harry"
Paul1968UK
QUOTE(clownboy @ Aug 30 2006, 08:51 PM) *
This has got to be the most interesting post here in months. Even though any Bigfoot relation is very remote and the whole cover up thing is bizarre to say the least, I find myself deeply interested in how these things came to be. It reminds me of a book I read called "Vallhala Rising" about Vikings coming to the new world hundreds of years before Columbus and leaving their artifacts behind. Thanks for the great post and I look forward to any serious additions anyone can add.




We all know Columbus wasn't the first to visit the Americas - he was just the first to do it with media attention.

According to legend (and not inconsiderable documentation), St. Brendan of Ireland was the first to visit America.

A few years ago, a Viking ship was recovered from Loch Ness - on board were coffee beans from South America - if ever there was proof that there were trade routes operating between Europe and the Americas long before Columbus set sail, this was it.
MooseMan
QUOTE(Paul1968UK @ Aug 31 2006, 01:05 AM) *
A few years ago, a Viking ship was recovered from Loch Ness - on board were coffee beans from South America


Wow Paul, that's the first I heard of that. I knew about the Viking settlement in Newfoundland but not that find. Cool!
Huntster
QUOTE(Paul1968UK @ Aug 31 2006, 02:05 AM) *
....A few years ago, a Viking ship was recovered from Loch Ness - on board were coffee beans from South America - if ever there was proof that there were trade routes operating between Europe and the Americas long before Columbus set sail, this was it.


Funny how so few know about that find.

Or, is it?
MooseMan
I try to keep up on all that stuff. I usually read 3 different news papers a day and various magazines every month. Don't know how I missed it.
Paul1968UK
A few years ago I was at a conference where there was an accusation that there was a huge Archaeological conspiracy to supress information - my brother who was with me made the comment that Archaelogists such as him simply wern't organised enough to keep anything quite.

In most cases, I suspect, people simply don't care. We have far too much going on in our lives to be bothered by such nonsense.

The only thing it will affect are the history books, which are so poorly written in the first place.
Huntster
QUOTE(Paul1968UK @ Aug 31 2006, 07:48 AM) *
...The only thing it will affect are the history books, which are so poorly written in the first place....


Yet, revising history books appears to be a huge thing. Anytime someone opines on commonly accepted history, others attack that opinion with great fervor. In the case of the Viking boat found in Loch Ness, like you pointed out, the coffee beans would appear to be enough proof that Columbus was not the first from Europe to reach North America.

It should be a done deal. It should be widely noted.

But it's not.

This offers insight into the sasquatch phenomenon.

Even proof sometimes might not be enough to change widely accepted knowledge...........
watch1
It may be that we have been given a very one sided view of history. Try changing it..it won't happen.

You just have to find it on your own. It's like finding footprints in stone. Form your own opinion as to how they got there..cover them up..and keep looking for Bigfoot tracks. Don't wait for the scientific community to give you their opinion.

Some may think I am joking and to a point I am. But the sad fact of the truth is this very thing is happening today. Discoveries are being made by people and are being covered up and not talked about. Why..because the last time they found something and reported it, the next thing they knew they had people running all over their place digging holes and and making a big mess out of everything. If you were the land owner..would you envite these folks back to your place? I don't think so.

Mike (watch1)
BigAlx
QUOTE(Paul1968UK @ Aug 31 2006, 09:48 AM) *
A few years ago I was at a conference where there was an accusation that there was a huge Archaeological conspiracy to supress information - my brother who was with me made the comment that Archaelogists such as him simply wern't organised enough to keep anything quite.

In most cases, I suspect, people simply don't care. We have far too much going on in our lives to be bothered by such nonsense.

The only thing it will affect are the history books, which are so poorly written in the first place.


The people that used to teach me were always concerned about keeping things quiet until they had all of their evidence (you never have it all do you?) and were able to publish the find.

Maybe there is some of that going on too?

We have a archaeological site two blocks from my house here in London where students can come and see that there is no Indiana Jones about.

cheers

Alex
Saskeptic
QUOTE(Paul1968UK @ Aug 31 2006, 03:05 AM) *
St. Brendan of Ireland was the first to visit America.


. . . and about 1000 years before Columbus.


Brendan, Holy Brendan.

He sailed uncharted waters he discovered lands unknown.

Brendan, Holy Brendan.

He was a saintly sailor, and he steered us safely home!
Volsquatch
And what would've happened if instead of finding coffee beans onboard the viking ship, they found the remnants of some sort of highly sophisticated computer which appeared to be light years ahead of us in technology, and not made of any materials found on this planet?

For that matter, what if instead of finding a viking ship, they found an alien spacecraft?
peregrine
QUOTE(Paul1968UK @ Aug 31 2006, 03:05 AM) *
A few years ago, a Viking ship was recovered from Loch Ness - on board were coffee beans from South America - if ever there was proof that there were trade routes operating between Europe and the Americas long before Columbus set sail, this was it.
The Viking ship in Loch Ness story can be found here at the Loch Ness Internet Exhibition, founded by the “world renowned meteorite researcher, Lord Stonecatcher PhD on 29 February 1999.”

In addition to the Vikings drinking coffee discovery, there are links to many other findings pertaining to Loch Ness, including a story about thermal vents associated with a super volcano located below Loch Ness by Professor Plume of the EU Volcanic Research Committee. Using “satellite laser topography sonar side-scanning techniques” to probe through thick sludge, Professor Plume found “monster sized sulphur feeding worms” (nematodes) and “zooplankton the size of a human fist that seem to be feeding on thermal vents.” The worms and plankton, along with the warm water around the vents, may have allowed Nessie to survive the Ice Age.

In another article, an American researcher speculated that the above mentioned warm water many permit “demonic” hagfish (“triple-hearted monsters”) to survive deep below Loch Ness. These “voracious predators” may be responsible for “the scarcity of many fish stocks within the loch.” Unfortunately, “The British Fish Recycling Research Association was unavailable for comment at time of going to press.”

Possibly the most disturbing account pertains to Loch Ness area residents and tourists “abducted by alien life forms” and “infected with mind-destroying spores.” According to Dr. Aileen Stein, leader of the Loch Ness Alien Infestation Project, the FBI is behind a plan “to contaminate the area with mind-altering mushroom spores.” Inhalation of these spores causes “psychosis and hallucinations and a high dosage leads people of very low intelligence to believe that they actually have some intellectual capabilities.” Fortunately, “The Polish Institute of Applied Psychological Solutions has taken a keen interest and is about to despatch an emergency team of psychologists and psychiatrists to the area.”

I hope CNN (or maybe Geraldo) does a follow-up of this tragic alien spore story.

A “radiation belt” also lies below Loch Ness. This radiation is apparently responsible for mutating plankton into aggressive carnivorous predators three inches in diameter, according to Dr. Postna of the Institute for Bio Aquatic Analysis. While “the ramifications for the rest of the planet are quite obvious,” some researchers are hesitant to publicize the risks to human swimmers because it “could harm the serious hunt that is continuing for the Loch Ness Monster.” The Inland Oceanography Council for Bio Aquatic Diversity Sciences was unavailable for comment at the time of going to press.

The radioactive belt may represent the remnants of a 5-kilometer wide asteroid that crashed into Loch Ness. Researchers, led by Dr. Albert Crater, now believe that the Loch Ness asteroid was responsible for the extinction of the dinosaurs.

The intrepid Professor Plume apparently does double duty, serving as the Loch Ness Research Team Leader. He has “released dramatic new evidence in support of a land based predatory Loch Ness Monster.” The “esteemed project leader” said, “We have been looking for proof that Nessie is capable of hunting on land ever since some local so-called researchers debunked the idea of a colony of monsters due to lack of food within the loch. Now we have found it. Nessie doesn’t rely on eels, plankton or seaweed; she can hunt down any beast in nearby farms or forests and has the strength to rip mature trees out of the ground.” Dramatic photographic support was provided (see image below).

Looks like there’s lots of rewriting to be done. Somebody call Lloyd Pye.
clownboy
Call me an idiot but what would be the point of Vikings sailing on Loch Ness? Isn't it a landlocked lake that is long and narrow? If so, it seems a far fetched idea that Vikings would drag their boat over land to deliver coffee beans to the Scottish Highlanders when a few horses or even foot messengers could easily do the job. Maybe I'm confused or misunderstood the picture being painted here.
DanChamberlain
I have it on good authority that what is being hidden in the Grand Canyon would effectively end the United States as a political, economic and military power! It's a sign that reads: "In the name of Ramsees, I claim this territory for the Pharoh! Everyone else...clear out!"

We'd have to start paying back rent and taxes! No wonder the Smithsonian is hiding something. They don't want to have to change their name to the Pharoh's Institution. What's worse, that little Egyptologist with the funny hat in all the pyramid documentaries would get the big office on the corner.

Dan
MooseMan
Viking travelled inland through Europe establishing many trading posts. Some of the portages over land were huge and, yes, they always took their ships with them.

It's not inconceivable they would have taken a ship to, or built one at Loch Ness. It was far easier to transport goods over water than land at that time.

As far as Nessie being a remnant trapped from prehistoric times, I thought that Loch Ness wasn't formed until after the last ice-age.


Map of known Viking trade routes.
watch1
"On Monday, the eighteenth of October, the Day of Saint Luke, the Governor arrived at Mabila, having passed that day through some towns (a day's walk northeast of Prairie Bluff; those fields are covered with traces of ancient civilizations; DeSoto advanced to Mabila ..

Just a clip from the full article LINK

They were calling what they saw traces of ancient civilizations in the 1500s.

Mike (watch1)
DanChamberlain
QUOTE(watch1 @ Aug 31 2006, 04:43 PM) *
"On Monday, the eighteenth of October, the Day of Saint Luke, the Governor arrived at Mabila, having passed that day through some towns (a day's walk northeast of Prairie Bluff; those fields are covered with traces of ancient civilizations; DeSoto advanced to Mabila ..

Just a clip from the full article LINK

They were calling what they saw traces of ancient civilizations in the 1500s.

Mike (watch1)



On their way to "Mabila", did they pass NeuArlens?

Dan
MooseMan
QUOTE
The reconstructions of three Norse buildings are the focal point of this archaeological site, the earliest known European settlement in the New World. The archaeological remains at the site were declared a UNESCO World Heritage Site in 1978. Exhibits highlight the Viking lifestyle, artifacts, and the archaeological discovery of the site.


from parks Canada
watch1
QUOTE(DanChamberlain @ Aug 31 2006, 05:54 PM) *
On their way to "Mabila", did they pass NeuArlens?

Dan



Mabila was spelled wrong. "We arrived at Mavila" Mavila was the way it was spelled then. Now it is Mauvilla.

The tug boat that hit the bridge that caused the Amtrac derailment was named Mauvilla. The name has changed now that the boat has been sold.
Warrior Gulf Navigation had almost all their boats named after American Indians.

Pushmataha
Cahaba
Cherokee
Creek
Seminole
Tombigbee
Tuscaloosa
Chickasaw
Tunica
Tallapoosa
Alabama

Just to name a few.

Most of these boats are still running the Tenn-Tom Waterway.

The exact location of Mauvilla has never been determined but some say they know the general location.

Mike (watch1)
RogerKni
Another find that qualifies as an elephant in the living room, because no specialist in the field dares to explore its implications, are the 50-odd Egyptian mummies whose hair and fingernails were analyzed by nuclear emission testing and found to contain nicotine and cocaine.

(How were these brought in? There were no "cigarette boats" in those days. Or were there ...?)
Dogfoot
So has anyone found a map of the Grand Canyon that has this place located on it? I'm looking, but have found only maps with no detail.
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