Hey all,
I was wondering if I had missed anything that had happened to the organization who must not be mentioned . :laugh:
The website hasn't updated but once this whole month with only one new report--wassup with that?
vlandrum

They all must be too busy,
out on expeditions having sitings themselves, :new_lmaosmiley:
to update anything. :new_whistle:








:anim_horse:

They where in my back yard about 3 weeks ago havent seen our heard form them in a while

I\'ve been in periodic contact with oen of their newer members, but not sure how involved he is with the politics of the group though.

I would think that if the commissar over there doesn't really care about the database, and if those who do have left the org, then new reports will be slow in coming.

there probly keeping any imformation under there hats they want to be the first to find it . They did mention to me that they had made some improvments to there site it doesent look any different then it did two years ago to me . I asked them not to post any thing about me and they havent so far at least they have respected my wishes . I am kinda disapointed with those guys myself not fish mind you the latest ones they called about 5 times everything was confirmed they where going to stay 2 nights and bring all there camaras night visions and such then they backed out more like chickened out they just dont makeum like they used too all I can say is they had there chance they will not get another from me

It would be a great idea if you were to ask them via their form. Then let us know.

Thanks,

BFRO members are on BFF, but may not be inclined to answer your question. Matt doesn't like it when his members go slumming in the BFF cesspool, especially when an honest reply might reflect poorly on him.

You can try asking your question on the BFRO forums or by submitting a comment. You might get a response.

Only about 15 BFRO members have published anything in June or July. Six of those fifteen have been with the org for a very short amount of time, three to six months max. I only count nine members with any tenure at all who have published a report in that time period.

The reports will pick up again eventually, even if Matt has to bring in new investigators. That's the draw to the site and the hook that gets people interested in expeditions. To intentionally stop publishing reports (and I have no idea if that's what happened or not) wouldn't be in Matt's best interests.

It might also be in Matt's best interest to post reports without any investigation at all. Anyone want to take any bets?

I don't even check the site anymore. I like the BF Encounters site betta.

I don't seem to be as schooled in the details of how that org went down hill, as others here seem too be. Need to read up on it. Hopefully there's info here I can find in a search.

The Wisconsin expedition's aren't reported at all. What happened with that???

hey everyone good morning im sure the bfro will updateing there resent reports section in time. there is a few class a sasquatch encounters reports that seem very interesting now. thanks bill

I posted this just a few weeks ago.

Last I heard there was a rule you had to talk to a witness at least on the telephone before publishing. Course, that may not be a rule anymore. More reports usually occur in the summer months when more people are out and about and Fall months during hunting season so I bet their database is backing up something awful.

BFRO recently removed my post on their site so someone is doing something there... guess quoting Coleridge just wasn't their bag.

I personally have had some unusual experiances with the BFRO. Here I am small time organization, just doing my thing, and at the beginning of the year I tried to give MM the benefit of the doubt, and see if our organizations could work together... Yeah, ANYWAY, he tried to sell me a 400 dollar trip to go where I usually go and do what I do most of my weekends, and then after seeing my web-page, decided to add a WA and OR trip to his schedule. I mean, I'll give it to him, he has the best sightings database, and the most media attention, but he sure has ticked off quite a few folks along the way. Ahh, thats my 2 cents....

Not surprised at all. tsk tsk

I'm a current BFRO member, and I'm not affraid to read, post or mention the BFF. The database IS backing up, partially because we lost some experienced, and I mean GOOD investigators, and loss of experienced personnel is hard on any organization.

Reports keep coming in. But with price of gas up like it is, many of us can't afford to run around like we used to, so most are not self assigning as many reports anymore. Reports are being investigated. To my knowledge the standard has not changed. There is no rubber stamp. More work on less people means less production.

For those of you who check our database, sorry for the slow progress and inconvienience. Many of us like to spend time in the field chasin, rather than on the phone talkin. When we come home from the field, we like to spend a bit of time with the family then get caught up on our real jobs. When we get around to it, we'll try to get some posted. Sorry for the low priority.

(check back in 24 hours to see if I'm still with the BFRO)

And to Bill Green, sorry I haven't called you from the field Bill, but I'd have to drive 28 miles to get close enough to a cell phone tower.

MstrOCraft

Thanks for the post MstrOCraft - of course there is a very good reason why the BFRO lost those good investigators, and that reason should be pretty obvious to everyone.

Despite my differences with MM, it is nice to see a BFRO member stand up for themselves for a change.

Paul (and others)

Why all those good people left is not obvious to me. Like I said, Ive been on several expeds and will be attending another in two weeks, and many many more after that. I wish I would have found the BFRO years ago. To think of the trips to the field that I've missed over the years, the good people that I failed to meet and now they are no longer with us in this life.

I put my own enjoyment and fulfillment first and foremost. Matt and I have had our moments, but I don't take it personal, and I don't even contemplate whether he does or not. The BFRO has a lot to offer me and I'm taking full advantage of the situation. I feel guilty having this much fun while my wife stays at home. To her co-workers, I am a GOD. As they see it, the mere fact that I have my wife convinced that I am out chasing Bigfoot, and she doesn't mind, puts me on a pedestal in their eyes. She's not really sure they believe that I really am chasing BF, rather than something else entirely.

I've seen on this forum where many have posted that they were contemplating going on one of the BFRO expeditions until they got "enlightened" by the threads on this forum. It saddens me that people who have had a falling out with Matt, who have experienced this great adventure, convince others to forgo the "experience." Sure, some will think they didn't get their money's worth, but others will be like me and find a new hobby/home after retirement. Some trips are better than others, because of what "happens" out there. But even on the slow ones I've been on, I've met a lot of good people, and even populated a good little group here in Washington that we wouldn't have, if we hadn't gone out with the BFRO and met one another. To me it's about friendship and networking.

I don't post here much because my integrity was called into question on if I remember correctly, my first post.

To those out there that thought about it, but haven't gone on one because you were "enlightened" about the real meaning of the BFRO, and the enuendo (sp?) that call backs and wood knocks are faked, I encourage you to take the plunge. What is it going to cost you? 10 cartons of cigarettes is $400.00 in todays market. And if you cram six in the car like some people are doing to keep the cost down, thats only (lets see, 10 cartons times ten packs per carton times twenty cigarettes divided by six people equals 133 cigarettes per person, feel free to check my math) And if you add up everything you hear on this forum about the BFRO, from the Matt bashers AND his loyal "puppet soldiers", it still doesn't amount to the WHOLE truth. The only way to get the whole truth is to experience it for your self.

If you are interested in going out and meeting great people, check in with me by pm. I'll tell you which ones I would go on and why. In some cases it might be because I don't feel the area has the potential, it might be who's coming (or better yet who's not), or it may just to be too far from home, thus too expensive.
Like I said some time ago, it's like elk hunting. The joy is in the hunt, and the people you hunt with. Packing out your kill is just plain damn work.

MstrOCraft

One question, an honest one. You used gas prices keeping BFRO members from investigating reports in the backing up database, but how much are the plane tickets from expedition to expedition and the gas prices driving around out on expedition? I'm not sure the gas prices could be used as a valid excuse except by those BFRO members on a shoe string budget who can't afford to go to on site investigations (or expeditions).

Shortage of members really shouldn't be an excuse. Back when I was with the BFRO there were only a handful of investigators publishing the brunt of the reports making it to the public. The rest were either sitting idle or doing other things. My question was how is it the expeditions can be afforded, but gas prices keep you guys from investigating reports? It might seem to some that the "fun" of the expeditions is favored over the drudgery of investigating reports that people have sent in hoping for a response from an organization. The people who send in older reports that could be investigated with a telephone call are just as important historically as the brand new ones with recent activity that some of the expeditions are based around. I guess it just proves my point the BFRO/MATT has become ALL about the expeditions/MONEY, since that's where everyone who can afford it is while the database is backing up. Those who don't have the money for the airfare and such for the expeditions are the only ones with a legitimate reason for gas prices and they could be sorting through the old reports where a telephone call would suffice. Where exactly is all of the money gleaned from the happy campers going? Couldn't some of those proceeds be funneled down to assist the investigators on the shoe string budgets so they could afford to get to on site investigations to clear the database or does that all just go into Matt's pockets? It seems to me that the organization isn't being run in a financially sound manner if gas prices is the reason people can't clean out the database. If that's the case Matt should get up off of his wallet and fork out some money for the research the BFRO is supposed to be doing and the database is an integral part of that research.

Thanks for responding MstrOCraft. I'm not trying to dog you about this, just bringing forth a point that I think is important, or at least should be. Packing out the kill may be "damn work," but it's the "meat" of the matter and unless you're a trophy hunter in it for the thrill, it's the reward that the hunt was all about in the first place.

Sorry, I have another question since you're answering them. Is the BFRO finding evidence and getting videos of sasquatches on expeditions and if so why has that evidence and/or video not been released to the public? Is it because Matt plans to make money from those? Every single expedition to date has had some sort of activity, vocals, knocking, sightings, et cetera. Does the evidence not hold up to scrutiny or does Matt merely want to make a buck? I'll certainly understand if you don't want to answer this one, because I think if you answer honestly, you'll be outside the BFRO looking in.

Again, thanks for responding, if you do.

Teresa,

That's one thing Matt made very clear to me on more than one phone conversation. He was/is looking to book the "jet-setters" for his expeditions. The ones who have enough money to sink into a four-day camping trip in order to cover his expenses. Of course, it doesn't appear to have worked out quite the way Matt planned it, and as Jud pointed out a while back, the pool will dry up for Matt eventually once more people begin to realize they can get much more for their money while still experiencing the same thing they experience on these BFRO "expeditions". It seems that many within the BFRO want everyone else to think that they've cornered the market on bigfoot research and that within the BFRO is where the talent lies. However, as Kevin has just pointed out, the BFRO lost the vast majority of their talent some time back, so that myth just doesn't fly to anyone who takes the time to investigate the current state of the BFRO themselves. Of course, to read what Matt has to say about the "expeditions" on the BFRO web site, he'd want us all to believe that the opposite is true.

Thanks for responding, mstrocraft.

If BFRO members are too busy to handle report submissions because other avenues of research are more productive (i.e. field work, expeditions, analysis of evidence) or members just have lives to live (we all do), then I suggest the BFRO submission form be shut down and the submitters should be redirected somewhere else if they want to speak to an investigator.

Other matters may be more important to Matt and BFRO members than processing submissions. That's fine. Just don't let the submissions go into a black hole, the reports pile up for years with potential evidence gathering dust, and the submitters wonder what the heck happened. I'm sure you see comments submitted daily asking, "What happened to my report?" Those people deserve a reply, and a small handful of the hundreds of reports may have physical evidence just waiting for someone to examine.

If there are BFRO members who are not contributing in one fashion or another to the enterprise (and there are many ways to do so besides reports) when they are fully able (life happens), then I question why they are in the org.

If the real problem with report publication is one of investigator retention and motivation of which report publication is just a symptom, then the root problem behind the membership loss needs to be addressed. This is what I believe the real issue is. I addressed it as best I could internally. However, the proposals I help put together were ignored.

None of the folks I hang with have such excess disposable income that they can flit from expedition to expedition, nor do they have the time away from work and family. It's all about priorities for most of the members of my group. I can hit the close ones, when I can trade days off and get someone to share the gas with me. Is gas the only problem? Of course not, but it is one being hotly discussed in our group. Rise in the cost of gas effects everything we do in our non squatch lives so it is a worry. And staying home from an expedition doesn't relagate our members to the database mill. I and many like me prefer to spend our time in the field. We have an excellent study area here and we like to spend every free minute checking it out for sign of activity. Do I like seing the database grow, NO. But were not all cut out to be investigators. Some are coordinators, some are better in the field, And some are just idea people, who can't carry an activity through to fruition. But they're all part of making the group work. I'm not talking about BFRO, just groups in general.

With regard to the money issues its a mute point to me. People on this forum grossly exagerate the amount generated and it could be for any of several reasons. Maybe they have no idea of the truth, they over simplify, or out and out decieve, I don't know and I don't really care. Unfortunately I don't know, nor have I ever met most of the folks who post here so I don't know their motivations or charactor traits. And I don't care to speculate because nine times (or more) out of ten I would be wrong. Most people say "correct me if I'm wrong". I say "correct me if I'm not right." I'll tell you how I feel about the BFRO. This baby is Matt's vehicle, I'm just glad I get to go along for a free ride. I've got nothing invested but my time, and for the enjoyment I get it's time well spent.

You said something in your response about "this only goes to prove" that you were right about some issue. It really proves nothing. I've seen sqatch before the BFRO, and I've seen him since. I've seen things in the past two years that prove he exists. But only to me. My evidence is not acceptable as proof to others so it becomes anecdotal (sp? unfortunately, I didn't get to keep my secretary when I retired, she could really proof read.)Not offended in the least. The facts I have are not the same set of facts that you are dealing with, so I take no umbrage from your response. I don't hunt for meat or trophy, I hunt for the companionship. , because THAT is what the whole hunt was about in the first place With regard to evidence, what the BFRO finds is not mine to disclose or even discuss. Only that which I generate/find, even on one of these expeditions is within my realm to disclose. But on that point let me say this, IMHO, neither the general public nor the scientific community at large deserves, nor will they receive open disclosure from me. This "sorry, let George do it" attitude of "bring in a body and THEN" does not fly with me. I'm an old soldier, and I spent a lot of time over my 28 year military career away from family, moving my household every one to three years to, I hope, help preserve our way of life. And it seems that the ones who reap the greatest benifit from my toils are the ones that silently sat at home on their ass, can I say ass here?, or carried the protest signs that sapped my soldiers morale. Not so in this endeavor. Those that serve along side me and support my "sasquatch tourism", for I am not a "researcher", will share in whatever I discover. I will say that of the seven expeditions that I have been involved in, only one failed to meet my expectations for activity, but all have resulted in developing lasting friendships. And having had to pack up and leave friends and family so many times in the military, I value what I hve gained in friends, from my BFRO association.

I hope this answers some of your questions, as I just came off 13.4 hours of graveyard and I am running on empty. I will have to let the other responses go for now but I will be back on tonight at work to address a few of the other questions (as best I can).

MstrOCraft

p.s. I hope this comes out ok as I have never used quotes like this before, and sorry for the mispellin

[EDIT] to help MstrOCraft with his quotes...

[b]Sorry, I don't think I can sleep with this one hanging over my head. This is like a sargeant saying "you people" when refering to officers, with one of their complaints. If I said "you people at the bff" (followed by a derogatory statement or accusation, it would be an affront to every member of this forum, including me. I wish the members of this forum would identify specific people by screen name rather than say "Many within the BFRO want. There are possibly some out there that would dialog with me if I wasn't openly out of the closet with regard to my BFRO membership. Arbitrarily branding me as one of Matt's puppet soldiers has probably cost me the opportunity to squatch with some of the bff members out west, specifically in WA. I don't recall ever taking a stand in this forum with regard to the BFRO, except to say that my association with the BFRO is definately benificial to me, and hopefully I'm giving something back for all that I receive. But, correct me if I'm not wrong.

On a side note, I would prefer my name not be used here, there are too many other Kevins out there for me to carry all their sins by association..

Thanks, you just gave me a wonderful idea. I'll discuss it with Matt when he calls to chastize me for sparring with you folks on the bff.

[EDIT] to complete the quote thing...

Seriously?

Presumably that means you are 100% okay with the nasty, malicious attacks on ex-BFRO members posted by Moneymaker on the bfro.net website?

And that you are 100% okay with the rediculous attack on the 'lies' told by Penn & Teller to 'boost their ratings'?

How anyone stays with that 'organisation' these days is beyond me, but I guess if that is okay with you, then that is a choice you have to make. If you are in it just for companionship, and not, as you say to investigate, then I have to wonder how many 'investigators' the BFRO actually has now, and how many, like you see it as a social club.

Nah, it only sounds like he's chastizing you, he secretly loves the attention.

RayG

That's such a far stretch its insulting.

Okay, so let me get this straight..... You have people who can't afford to drive 50 miles to talk to someone about a report because of gas prices; but they will give up time with their family, and take off of work, to drive a 1000 miles, pay $400 (or whatever it is now) bring their own equipment, food, etc. to sit out in woods with people who they want to make buddies with, when they could have just called up a few of their own buddies and driven to the local lake. Or local hot spot. How does that make sense? Especially since there is no way to guarantee activity. Well..... there is one way I guess...

But not all of them do that, some just coordinate the trips, others go into the area to make sure the place is fit for trips, and some just have ideas about the trips.

I would think that a major part of the BFRO would be people investigating the reports so you would know where to go on the next exped.? If there isn't SOMEONE in the org. that will stop whining and actually do some leg work, how do you know where to go? Do you just pick a spot that looks pretty and hope for the best? And how long do you think that org. is gonna last with no one doing any real work? If everyone says, "oh no, I'm more fit for the field!" how are you going to know where to go, or what's going on with Bigfoot? I thought the purpose of the BFRO was to learn more about these creatures? Instead of going off into the woods, hoping to see one; why don't you talk to the people that have? Talk to the people that have see them doing things?

And here's my biggest question. Most people who are lucky enough to ever see a Bigfoot, only see one once. They get a glimpse of one walking through a field, or across a road, and that is it. So are you getting multiple reports from one person or area, is that how the areas for the expeditions are picked? And if that is the case I have another question.... Does anyone who is there actually interview the person reporting the sitings? Or do you all just go off into the woods figuring someone else will do it?

Why would you say that? Everything he said about MM is 100% correct, all documented here on BFF and other places. If it's the last paragraph you're referring to I interpreted what you said the same way.

Well, that's great, but what about the research?



Okay, this again, is great and I'm glad you're having a ball, but what about the research, you know, the animal, conservation of said animal? Anything at all that smacks of investigatory field work? It sounds like you're on one vacation after another.



Correct me if I'm "not right" here but it sounds like it's all about the fun, and the research is just "plain damn work."



If everybody thinks this way, no wonder the database is backing up and there've only been, what was it again, three reports, published in the last two months??



Maybe yall should dump some of those people "who can't carry an activity through to fruition" and try to get some GOOD investigators to work on that backlog. I don't read the BFRO site, can't really wrap my head around what it's become, but I would think you owe it to the people who are sending in reports who expect a research organization to contact them. From where I'm sitting, it doesn't look like the group "works."




Maybe a small investment of time in the database cranking out a report or two? I see it differently than you do. I think you guys have an obligation to those people sending in reports who believe they are going to get a telephone call from someone interested in sasquatch. :new_weirdsmiley:



:doh: Here I thought it was about researching the possible existence of a undocumented North American primate. From where I'm sitting the word "Research" should just be taken completely out of the title and it should be the BFO if what you're saying is the norm and not the exception.



Are you for real? Aren't we all trying to do the same thing? Again what happened to the research? Has it become just one big party? Nobody is going to divulge anything found, not EVEN to the scientific community? :doh: That is probably the most telling thing I've heard so far come from a BFRO member. Unbelievable. Does everybody feel that way? The fact that NOTHING in the way of evidence is coming out of the BFRO is certainly an indicator to me. Correct me if "I'm not right."



What exactly are you giving back? It's all about the fun, the companionship and the thrill as you've said above, what are you giving back to the organization and more importantly, the research with an attitude like this?

Nobody is happier than I am that you've served this country, but that has nothing to do with the research. What parallel are you drawing between the two? I don't get that connection at all. :ohmy:

The BFRO is obviously in worse shape than even I had imagined if this is the norm and not the exception with regard to attitude and motivation.

My apologies. I guess I should have included your surname as well. Didn't figure you'd mind since you already outed yourself here on the forum.

[edit] Was typing when you made your post, T. Excellent post it was too. I couldn't agree more, and you know what? that's the shame of it.

Are you for real? Aren't we all trying to do the same thing? Again what happened to the research? Has it become just one big party? Nobody is going to divulge anything found, not EVEN to the scientific community? :doh: That is probably the most telling thing I've heard so far come from a BFRO member. Unbelievable. Does everybody feel that way? The fact that NOTHING in the way of evidence is coming out of the BFRO is certainly an indicator to me. Correct me if "I'm not right."

ARsquatch: I think if you knew me, many of these questions would be answered. I am the exception, not the rule, in BFRO. Your concern about sharing of evidence is worthy of clarification, though. I stated that I would not openly offer info to the Sci Comm AT LARGE. Those that support us in our endeavors, and I don't use names here, but you know who they are. Of course they have a right to be first to look at any evidence I might be lucky enough to produce. But I don't speak for the BFRO or Matt, only myself. My attitude to those who demand a body before they will even consider any "other" evidence probably comes from my reading of Sanderson's Abominable Snowman.

Am I for real? yes, but your literal interpretation of what I write in this "form" of communication, and the assumptions you make about my character are most likely invalid. I hate this form of communication because it doesn't allow you to get to know the real person behind the keyboard before you decide you don't like them. I would much rather discuss Squatch face to face, because I do care, I do research, I do try to employ what I know of the scientific method as best I understand it. I am not a scientist, I have no background in that area. My degree was in Government and Military Science, which isn't that helpful in trying to scientifically research North America's greatest mystery (at least for me).

Though I try not to form opinions of you, and others, that respond to my one sided communications, its hard not to when a person has been lurking on this forum for the past year. This "quote - rebutt - quote - rebutt -etc" is a very "challenging" form of communication. If one ignores the "affront" he's seen as weak, if he gets pissed and responds, he's an ass. It's a lose lose situation.

What do I give back? I hope something.

MstrOCraft

[EDIT] more quote corrections...

Not offended, just prefer to be positively identified when being discussed or responded to. Adding surname is fine, unless you're calling me a dumb s**t or something. Then leave off the surname so those that don't know me will think its one of the other Kevins your refering to.

[EDIT] more quote-fixing...

I probably know more about you than a lot of people other than BFRO members here Kevin (Jones). I spoke with you on the telephone back when I was still with the BFRO about a very personal post you made to the entire BFRO group about your war experience, and asked if you meant for it to go out to everyone because it was of a very personal nature. As a moderator for the group list I was going to pull that post if you had made it in error to the group, however, you said you did mean for everyone to read it, and we spoke for a while. I do know your history as you laid it out in the post you made to the BFRO list. I applaud your service to our country and am aware of the sacrifices you made. I'm also relieved that you say you do take research seriously and do share what you find with the scientific personnel of your choice, whomever they may be.

As for making assumptions, I went by your own posts. I thought you had certainly changed since last we spoke since you seemed committed to the research back in the day. Again, I was using your own words to draw a conclusion. As you say this is not the best form of communication and sometimes it's a lose lose situation. I've found honesty is certainly the best policy when dealing with the sharp minds here on the BFF.

Thank you for your post here.

Teresa Hall
Former Proofreader and AR Curator BFRO

I just have some teensy tiny questions regarding that T. If the info and ( I shudder to say it ) " evidence" is so compelling that they can find seemingly at will on any given expedition where are the scientific write ups of it ? The studies of the alleged vocalizations ? Any one bother to pick up one of the allegedly thrown rocks and test for prints ? Go to the area of a supposed scream and look for prints or other evidence such as hair samples ? Or is it just a matter of ' Yup that was a bigfoot!!" ? Because based on the expedition reports the last question looks to be the most accurate one.

As far as the last being former military myself as far as sasquatch research goes .. So what ? Seems to me at any rate that there are more than a few people who see that as some sort of 'trump card ' in the face of questoning them about events and previous writings.


Investigator : " Can you o tell me about the alleged vocal you heard?"

Respondent : " Um..well it was..uhhh well kinda like a coyote but differnt ,,Hey !! I mention I served in the marines ?"

Investigator : " Really ? The marines ? Great !! Thank you . Have a nice day "


Pop up a post with fireworks attached and watch the oohh and ahhs start next. Seriously, Kevin . for all of your alleged encounters on the trips, what do any of you have to show for it any more than any one of the other 3000 plus members of this forum ? Because from where I'm sitting , it doesn't amount to Jack.

Teresa brought up earlier but you seem to have missed it. The reports are what gave you the leway to go on these expeditions in the first place. Without them the BFRo wouldn't be there for you to attend these social gathers with. Maybe you should, or whoever there is supposed to think of those things these days, think about that and figure out where you would be without all of those reports and people you haven't bothered to respond to.


*edit* Here a typo, there a typo, everywhere a typo. Old MacDonald had a keyboard .EIEI-OOOO !! *

Good questions Jim, and I'd like to know the answers to those myself from the BFRO/Matt, but I'm betting we won't get any answers other than Kevin's and how they pertain to himself. Best I can tell he's not speaking for the BFRO and well... the honcho isn't too good at defending the issues himself, and resorts to name calling and throwing dirt and tantrums.

I think the witnesses who have taken the trouble to fill out the submission form should be taken into consideration and if not a visit, then at least a telephone call should be made. I'm not thinking so much of the public's right to know, but the witnesses who should be considered.

Oh... and Jack left town.

Thought that was him passing me on the freeway. Speedy little cuss.

Hey all,
I originally asked the question because I thought that I had missed some bit of info about them redoing the database, or updating on a new schedule, etc.--I really didn't want this to turn into a typical "bash the BFRO" thread, so I've asked the great powers that be on BFF to lock this topic.
Sorry for stirirng up the hornet's nest--peace to all.
vlandrum

I don't think it's gotten to the lock-it-up point. Nobody's bashing anybody that I can see, though the truth might hurt a bit.

No, it hasn't. (Going OT or sidetracking isn't a "lockable" offense either.)

I'm not even sure it went off topic. The topic was Wassup with the BFRO...

Your post said:


Well..... now we know

this whole discussion seems a bit craze? maybe someone would like to fill me in a bit, i might have missed something? from what i understand, the BFRO has become a business. somewhat along the services a hunting guide provides. right? i mean if i didn't take pride in choosing my own area and planning my own trip then surely i would pay someone else to set the whole thing up for me. tell me where to be, when to be there, and what to bring. is there anything wrong with that? from my point of view " an outside perspective " it seems that the BFRO is the first to really corner the market for those services in the bigfoot world and others tend to dislike them for that. hmm......

as for the original topic of the BFRO updates. i can't wait till they get back on it and i get some fresh reading material!

its late. i hope it came across properly

Nevermind, what's the point of it.

That's just it folks.... what you read here is folks opinon.

Don't like the thread, where it's headed.

Don't read or just turn away, I have.

We all know you dislike the BFRO, why do you all take the effort in constantly bring up your dislikes about it... it's the same over and over again.

MR. Jones was just trying to be honest with himself to you and responding to the original title... not defending the BFRO, a researcher who wanted to bring his toys to the table and you beat him with his words (My opinion of course).

I am not involved in the research of the BFRO or the group that KJ is still involved here in Washington State, I do know that he is putting together something to share with other folks that would like to know, possibly hear, or see for themselves. We all have questions that need to be answered.... he is trying to do what he can to provide some type of assistance.

Another thing that is bothering me is that you say you know a person by a couple of phonecalls. I spent over 20 days with KJ, either in the field or traveling to a site, can't say that I know him as well as you do by a few phone calls, I have an opinion of him.

I respect him. WHY? For the person that he is. For the solider that he is. Hats off to him as a person.

I disliked that way folks were treated in the BFRO.... that chapter is over, let's move on folks.

mel skahan
unedited of course... my style

Gilbert... you are missing the point, no one (well at least not myself) sees anything wrong with someone having a business, so to answer your question, no, there is nothing wrong with that. Rather, it's all about 'how' a business is operated that permeates the discussion here - nothing more, nothing less, imho.

As far as your statement about why you think people "tend to dislike" the BFRO, it is not as you assume. If you have the time, you can do some research and reading here and get the entire story from every point of view you can imagine and then make up your own mind based on the facts.

(btw, welcome to the forums.)



And hey ARsquatch - sweetie, buddy, T.... you got any aspirin you can send me?? my widdle head hurts... :icon_bang: :new_tiredsmiley: :icon_abduct: :anim_horse: :1106: :surrender: :guinness: :new_sleepysmileyanim:

:lock:

The BFRO was my first favorite BF website... but I have seen some big (maybe not for the better) changes going on with the site, but I still check it from time to time... As far as the lack of new reports go, well after having read every report on the BFRO (several times each), I do get a little disappointed now a days that there's nothing new to get excited about - but before I had read all the reports I just simply went to the database…

:new_whistle:

Hi Mel, how ya doing? I understand your point, but it misses mine (and I suspect others as well, although I do not claim to speak for them). I'm not "taking effort to constantly bring up my dislikes about" BFRO. If I respond to something said/implied/suggested about BFRO that I know from my own experience does "not quite" reflect reality I feel a great inner need to set the record straight - that's where my effort goes. And, that is an effort of mine that applies to things non-BFRO related as well.

Once a person has the facts... especially new folks like Gilbert who are sincerely trying to understand what the hoopla is all about... then they are free to come to their own conclusions. But they can't do that without full possession of the facts. Once they have the facts, and if they then make a conscious choice to go on a BFRO bigfoot tour or be a BFRO 'investigator', then that is fine and dandy by me.

This whole field of Bigfoot Research is all about sorting out fact from fiction... I think we should all be committed to keeping those facts - whatever they are - in the forefront, and shining a spotlight on the fiction whenever we see it sprout up.


imho

Whats the point of it?

This whole thread is about why the database has not been updated.

Then the whole long quoted and excessive debate starts with the disgruntled BFRO ex-members who felt that their personal opinions and advice on how to run an organization had been totally ignored and that MM would not bend to their wishes as well as heated discussions as certain persons who continue to post it over and over and over can't accept that the head of the organization does not have to change his approach based on their opinions or advice. Do American Corporations or any business for that matter change their business practices based on Your Personal Opinion?

Why is it that you who are so disgruntled with the BFRO do not start your own expeditions based on how you feel they should be run, do your own research and keep it updated, and run your own website for reporting (and make sure your Metatags get you on the top of the search list)? Wait, may it be that you don't have the time and money to dedicate yourselves, but you do have the time to spend hours on this forum to input your opinions......... Seriously, why don't you personally start up the type of organization you are expecting from someone elses?

I am not a BFRO member, I have not been on an expedition, I personally don't judge that organization based on others opinions, I can make my own determination and would only do based on personal contact and experience.

I totally understand mstrocraft. Those people that accuse him of not being a fair player because he enjoys the expeditions and is not a researcher have absolutely no right to attack him for his opinions and for his enjoyment of getting out and being social in a field of interest. He claims in no uncertain terms that he does what he does for him, what is wrong with that, since when do any of us owe the field of bigfoot research anything based on someone elses determination or expectations?

If you personally feel that the FIELD is owed more, get your ass out of the chair and get out there, get the job done, get a new database up and running, get some expeditions planned, don't bash people who are not doing things YOUR WAY. I am sure that there is no justification for your inability to do so.

So does it come down to anytime someone goes into the field to take a look around and does not report their findings to the BFF they are not loyal to the field and they are not doing their 100+% to further the cause. To each his/her own, nobody is regulated to conform to someone else expectations, especially those who would rather sit back and yack and do absolutely nothing to change the situation. What right do you have to determine who is right and who is wrong in how they approach this field of interest?

Mstrocraft, you have no obligation to respond to those who would determine your character, your responsibility or have an opinion about your service to our country, that is what the IGNORE member function is for.

The BFRO does not have to anwer to anyone unless they feel inclined to, for those who insist that the BFRO's database is in jeopardy, do something about it instead of being critical of others. There is more discussion on MM's money making venture then there is replies to those who discuss making money off the body of a bigfoot or selling rocks on Ebay. :icon_bang: