It is solid rock and was picked up about fifteen years ago on a local riverbank right after the water had been very high. Weighs about 19 lbs. If you look closely it has what appears to be the left mandibular articulation, auditory canal, and the supraorbital margin all in their approximate correct locations... The second pic is a more frontal view showing what appears to be the lacrimal and ethmoid bones inside the orbit along with the nose, outer ear, and several teeth. The next picture shows the underside with what appears to be the foraman magnum and carotoid foraman and condylar fossas, also all in their approximate correct locations. Either it is a amazing coincidence of a natural formation or something else. I have many more photos if anyone is interested.



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I would like to see more pics. The colors look strange for it to be a rock?? Is this thing in a museum?

Sunflower

Thats actually pretty interesting!

The camera flash brought out much more color in the rock then is visible to the naked eye. No, not in a museum... it's sitting right here next to me and available for anyone to analyze in person if they want to. Another very interesting feature is what appears to be a very deep perfectly formed knife wound in the top.



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I've had it for fifteen years and always assumed it was a the fully fossilized remains of a prehistoric human being (even though they claim soft tissue fossilization - or more accurately premineralization - is EXTREMELY rare). Nevertheless, about ten years ago I took it to a Geologist at a rock and fossil shop in Vacaville, California and after looking at it for a long time he said it was either the most amazing example of natural formation following human anatomy or something that would set the scientific world on it's ear. He strongly advised me to take it to a major University and have it analyzed. So I did what any busy single parent would do and that was to take it back home and put it back under my bed. Ten years later (this afternoon) all of a sudden out of the blue it hit me.. Maybe, just maybe it ISN'T of pre-human origin after all, maybe it was the fossilized remains of some other hominid type creature... which is what led me to post the pics.

Still a busy, single parent?

Maybe it's time to follow up on that man's good advice.

Where did you find it? Please do have it analyzed!!

Sunflower

A second thought, it looks almost like it was mummified then fossilized, is that possible?

Sunflower

Nah, kids married or off to college. I was thinking about sending it to Dr. Meldrum to see what he thought of it. Below is something I just did that I think is fairly compelling...

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I will gladly tell you where I found it in a private message but I'd rather not give the exact location here... Funny you should mention that about mummification (good eye!). Yes, it looks like that could be very possible. I am not a geologist or a paleontologist but from what I understand in order for soft tissue to fossilize it has to fall into deep very cold water and then become covered up with mud almost immediately where there would be no oxygen available for decomposition to occur. (which is very possible considering where it was found.. think California gold rush). Then over time the tissue is slowly replaced by minerals leaving what is in essence a perfect cast of the original specimen.

:popcorn2:

I honestly don't have a problem with you pouncing on coastalyeti about the bigfoot he claims to have killed ten years ago. I just think that the irony is too much.

I know it's 3am, LOUD thunder storms bounced me out of bed...couldn't help thinking about the "head under your bed" have it checked out.

Sunflower

It's solid rock... maybe it once was, but that would have been waaaay before my time...



Pouncing? I don't consider asking a few reasonable questions "pouncing" at all.

Please have it looked at and keep us all updated, this is very interesting, it certainly ticks a lot of boxes

That is very interesting, thanks for sharing this with us. One possibility no one has mentioned is something shaped by carving. I have a co-worker’s grandfather found a human like head carved out of a rock on his farm. He advised there is an area on the farm where the ground is so hard that they couldn’t even plow it. He thought it was where they Indians had ceremonies of some type.

Having the rock/fossil analyzed is a good suggestion. I think we’ve all heard stories about discoveries being taken to different labs and universities where it was analyzed incorrectly or even lost all to gether. :new_weirdsmiley: So to get an honest evaluation.

Where should it be taken?

I showed it to a Geologist about ten years ago and they confirmed that it was definitely not carved or hand made in any way. I do have some concerns about letting it out of my sight, although I did send a crystal specimen with a mass of silver vermiform (worm like) inclusions embedded in it to the Arkansas State Geological society (great guys by the way) a few years ago and they analyzed it and sent it back with no problems at all. Nevertheless, I think I'll contact Dr. Meldrum and see if he might be interested. If he is I am only a day's drive from him so maybe I'll run it up there personally instead of taking the chance with UPS or (shudder) the USPS. If not then I guess I'll just put it back under my bed....

Sounds like you’re on top of it, good luck I hope it turns out to be a significant discovery. I know I’m look forward to the results. :popcorn2:

So when are you leaving for Dr Meldum's place? Technically, you have been on top of it (it's been under your bed). I think I had a dream last nite (and then the storm hit), about the "head under the bed."

You mentioned that you noticed something that looks like teeth; can DNA can be extracted from a fossilized tooth? Does anybody know?

Sunflower

Dr. Meldrum said the he can see no details of skeletal or dental anatomy (other then the orbital margin) that would indicate it as a skull. Oh well.. on to other things I guess.

I'm a little confused.....

Did Meldrum look at it in person, or just from the pics you have?

This thing is too bizarre to just be a natural formation of some kind, but maybe I'm wrong....

He is a very busy man and so I just asked him to take a look at the pictures that are here on this thread so I didn't clog up his E mail with large attachments unless he requested them. I also sent the same low res pics to an Anthropologist at UC Berkeley last year and she said pretty much the same thing as Dr. Meldrum. The only scientist to look at it in person was the Geologist in Vacaville and he was very impressed. I'm sure it is immediately discounted when looking at the photos because they are looking for the anatomy of a bare skull instead of something that became fully fossilized prior to becoming fully skeletonized. I can see it now, someday (probably long after I'm dead and gone) someone at a lab somewhere is going to look at it with the possibility of it having a large amount of fossilized soft tissue (something for some reason most scientists refuse to even consider) and say HOLY COW look what I discovered! Oh well, life goes on.


Maybe I should have sent this one...


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maybe try like an MRI or one of those full body scan places it might reveal some details inside, probably to costly and may not work on a rock but just an idea.

califb,

This is a serious question. How friendly are you with your dentist? Scientist of a sort, right? If you can determine that those are teeth, why wouldn't a dentist?

Sunflower

As a last resort, I'd have that sucker cut in half. I'd like to see what it may look like from an inside side view.

LOL... you and my ex-husband . I had a genuine fossilized dinosaur egg that he hit with a sledge hammer because he wanted to see if there was anything inside it. I still have all of the pieces but it's value had dropped considerably.

About having it analyzed.. all is not lost just yet. There may be something in the works. I'll keep you posted when I know more.

califb,

Good, I'm glad you changed your mind about putting it back under the bed, which really gives me the creeps when I picture that in my mind...

Sunflower

Funny. I have an antique bed that sits up high off the ground that has several boxes and buckets full of all kinds of "goodies" I've found stashed underneath it. Below is something else I found (not to worry, it's solid rock). I don't know quite what to make of this either...




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Where did you find that? It kinda looks like an old dried out rump roast...

Sunflower

Could be a heart still in its dermis sack

I'm with Scotto .... "BI-SECT" that sucka !!!! :new_thumbsupsmileyanim:

I found it about a mile from the other find on the same river. This is just the tip of the iceberg of some of the strange things I've found over the past twenty years. For example, a couple of years ago I was helping a friend install tile at a vacant house and when I went outside to cut a piece of tile I noticed an area along side of the walkway that was filled with rocks with one that looked exactly like a large (about 8" long) raw potato, eyes and all. When I picked it up I noticed that it had a deep hole in it that looked like it was made by an insect of some sort. I sawed it in half with the tile saw and found a fully fossilized adult caterpillar at the end of the hole inside the rock. It was really interesting. I had cut it so when you opened it up you could see the entire length of the hole with the bug at the very end. I ended up selling it and it is now on display at a college in Pennsylvania.

Pretty interesting rock skull. I am a geologist and my first impression was that it was flint though it is hard to be sure. It is very unusual. I assume its resemblance to a skull is just an amazing coincidence. There are lots of people with mineral collections and I wouldn't be surprised if someone might pay pretty good money for such an interesting rock.

I'm obviously not a geologist, or an archaeologists, or even an anthropologist, but I have to say I see nothing about this that would lead me to believe it was anything other than a funny shaped rock. Any resemblance to a human skull seems like a real stretch to me. Sorry, I'm with Jim and Jeff on this one.

PS- Could we all please try to refrain from titling threads like this? I can't keep any of them straight. I'd suggest something at the very least saying what sort of an object 'this' is referring to.

Yes, these "teaser titles," as I call them, annoy me too. They will make it less likely that newcomers a year from now, browsing the archives, will bother to click on a thread thus named. Since I see BFF's value as mostly a resource for researchers, not as an entertaining-at-the-moment-but-evanescent chat-room-on-steroids, accurate descriptive titling is a Must. (At least add a descriptive subtitle on the second line, if you feel you have to use a teaser in the initial line.)

I've edited the subtitle for clarity.

Thanks, I wasn't thinking when I entered the title. (although I don't agree with the "looks like a heart" and should read "looks like a head" but it isn't a big deal).

The second rock looks like a heart--that's probably the one bipto saw when he hit page-up. Suggested revised subtitle: "Head- & Heart-Shaped Rocks".

I'd be willing at some point (when I'm less busy) to go thru the BFF archives & add, or suggest to Paul for him to add, subtitles to items with "teaser titles."

If that rock is bisected, it should be done under professional auspices, and only after it has been photographed in such a way that a rotatable & slice-and-dice-able 3-D digital version could be posted on a Bigfoot Online Museum. (Along with similarly photographed track- & butt-casts.) (I think this technique is done to statues with lasers as they are rotated so that very accurate molds can be made of them from which copies are made of the original.)

How about "Rocks shaped like various organs and appendages"?

I have to agree. It's odd, but it looks like a rock to me (I think is chalcedony...and if you found that near where you live califb, there is a chalcedony quarry up stream from that lake...if that makes any sense to you). Both rocks are very neat though!

Just on Friday, a guy brought in a bone for me to examine (I examine all bone remains for Tuolumne County). He thought it was fossilized human bone and was pretty disappointed when I told him it was neither human nor fossilized!

I was originally skeptical of that rock, but the last picture of it seemed pretty intrigueing. I think it can't really be judged unless it's seen in 3-D and from every angle. Therefore it should be displayed at a Bigfoot conference where a bunch of people can really get a gander at it, and hopefully where some bone-experts can weigh in. A conference-organizer should ask for a loan of it.

LOL.... there ya go.. :new_thumbsupsmileyanim:

[quote name='Hairy Man' date='May 14 2006, 11:48 AM' post='315153']


I have to agree. It's odd, but it looks like a rock to me (I think is chalcedony...and if you found that near where you live califb, there is a chalcedony quarry up stream from that lake...if that makes any sense to you). Both rocks are very neat though!



It wasn't found near the lake. It was on the Yuba River below Smartsville.

thats really weird looking. does it have that waxy feeling like calcites do? not that that would mean anything, i'm just curious.

i know the rock shop you're talking about in vacaville. i grew up in napa, with family in sac, so we traveled past that place all the time.

gael

That is very odd. But rather than Patty, I find it more so vaguely reminiscent of Buddy Hacket. :ohmy:

That could become rather a tedious occupation for you no?

Cheers

Alex

Hi Gael,

No waxy feel at all. It's got to be the same place - a big metal building with a sign that just says Rock Shop that sits right on the side of the freeway.. Did you ever stop by? It is an amazing place. They had (or maybe still have) a Saber Tooth Tiger skull on a stand with teeth that were 8" long. I never could come up with the $500 bucks they wanted for it though...

no, i've never stopped, but each time i drive by, ever since childhood, i've wanted to pop in and see what he's got in there. i've heard marvelous things from people who shop there.

i'll give the boyfriend a friendly nudge in that direction asap

gael

Hmmmmm... now that you mention it I see it too.. I wonder where Mr. Hackett was on that day? LOL

Vacaville? Soft tissue could fossilize if covered in really wet mud. Lot of mudslides in that part of CA. Also, soft, fatty tissue will turn in to adiposere and not decompose if kept in an airless and "moist" environment for extended periods of time, a decade or more. After that, it could fossilize. It is an interesting rock formation. You will undoubtedly meet with a lot of "official" resistence on your find. On the other hand, it would drive me craze having it and not finding out the truth once in for all.

Dan C

I agree with Dan, it would drive me crazy too. I would try for a second opinion before sticking it back under your bed.

Sunflower

Purty rock,you never know could be something orta have it looked at.

Look like concretions of chert or flint (like JimZenor suggested). These can form around bits of shell or other organic material and form interesting pseudo-fossils. If these came from an area with lots of sedimentary rock, you could potentially find all sorts of cool-looking specimens. :new_thumbsupsmileyanim: