Any opinions on this?

I have seen a lot of Bigfoot reports stating animals were afraid of something, acting unusually afraid. These may be deer, dogs, horses or whatever. My questions is what does an animal think that a Bigfoot is, why would it be afraid of one since in all likelihood a family dog for example has never seen a Bigfoot before, it is not like they are that common. I would assume some of it may be attributed to instinct but don’t dogs bark at something as large and ferocious as bear and cougars? so why would they be so frightened of a Bigfoot?

Just wondering if any thoughts on this?

Good question.

Dogs, I know more about. It could be that the dog is picking up the fear from a human nearby. It is well documented dogs emulate they're owners emotions. -No sources, sorry-

My dogs sure aren't afraid of skunks, but then again they have never seen a bf either.

The reaction would probably be barking and then tail wagging for mine.

When I was just a kid back in the 50s it seemed all our neighbors had cats rather than dogs. One summer, about 1958 or so, a lot of the neighboring cats began to just disappear - over night it seemed; no road kill carcasses or any evidence of where they went was ever found; and we all wondered what was going on with the cats. We lived in a new development (just a handful of houses, really) next to a forest with a very large peat bog and a couple of large ponds.

So, neighbors with kids, who had lost cats, began replacing their lost cats with others from (usually) the SPCA. Not long after we noticed that a curious thing had started to happen. As kids, we'd get up in the morning and go outside to look for our cats. And there they were, high up on the rooftops of our houses! This was indeed something new. I recall my sister would often let our cat in through her second story bedroom window in the morning. At the time we thought it sure was strange, seeing all the neighborhood cats on the rooftops in the early morning, meowing, hungry, trying to get down. Some neighbours had a hard time getting their cats to come down; they were obviously afraid of something.

Years later it became apparent that there had been BF activity in the area for some time; and the curious behavior of the 'survivor' cats at last seemed to make some sense.
Dudlow

Well.... I'll be damned.....
That IS interesting !!!

As far as horses go, depending on the animal, they will spook at a piece of paper blowing in the wind.
As far as a b/f goes, no one really knows what an animal would think. We can only assume.
As far as dogs go, again, depends on the animal. I can give an example of strange dog behavior.
<<<but I cannot say the dogs behavior was indeed related to a b/f, we never got a clear view of what exactly was causing the dogs behavior>>>
We had something lurking around, the dog would go nuts to the point that he would go hoarse and foam at the mouth. The dog was half pit and half bassett hound. His bark was different to the point that it sounded intense, totally different from how he would react to a stranger, cat or stray dog. He acted as though whatever it was, he wanted to "kill it". We used to set out a sound activated recorder, during one recording the dog was going ballistic, reacting to noises we were able to hear over the recorder, when whatever it was got to the point where it would have been in full view of the dog, the dog never made another sound.

If only animals could talk.

This is from TO THE GIANT AMONG US
-- Sports Illustrated, December 21, 1981 - a part of an article about Andre the Giant




Andre was listed at 7'4" and 500 pounds -I've never seen a bigfoot or a dog react to a bigfoot but I have seen Andre the Giant in person and up close and believe me he was frightening looking.
Now add to that- hair covered body ,ape like face and a terrible stench and in my own opinion I could see why a dog would be frightened. Not scientific ,but it works for me.

Howdy, Painthorse. On the off-chance you haven't heard of this, I'll just mention that there are many reports of 'witches' braids' carefully braided into horses' manes by BF. For some reason (unknown to us) BF has a fascination with braiding the manes of some (although not all) horses. And it seems some horses put up with this without making a noisy fuss. I believe this phenomenon was first named as witches' braids in New England somewhere. I have read reports of this from B.C, Oregon and the New England areas. It apparently occurs both out in the pastures as well as inside barns at night.
Dudlow

Witches braids? I'm not familiar with them! What are they, and how do they look? And, especially, how are they attributed to bigfoot? I don't remember ever reading about this in the reports I've read. I'm really curious...

FWIW...Feral dogs frequently are found in the habitat with gorillas and chimps and have certainly been used to hunt them- usually just for the tracking/treeing part. There are surprisingly few known/documented interactions between feral dogs and wild apes. I've been with wild gorillas when a feral dog simply bolted out of the bushes and took off. Could have been stalking them (I don't think so), could have been trying to hide and bolted when it's cover was blown (my bet).

A friend of mine was once with gorillas when they stumbled upon a feral dog caught in a snare. The dog was terrified and wouldn't even look at the gorillas. Made himself small and seemed to act like if he was quiet and still they might not see him. The gorillas were a little curious and as I recall poked the dog a couple times, but then just moved on. The dog was obviously way outnumbered and not in any position to defend itself much, but still interesting. I suspect dogs frequently react this way if they encounter gorillas in the wild. Mostly with fear or at least caution recognizing that there are much easier prey items to be found.

There are many cases of captive apes being kept with dogs and they usually get along famously. The apes always seem to know that they are superior to the dogs and often treat them more like pets than equals. I could share many enecdotes of those cases. The dogs might like to play with the apes when they are accustomed to them (and the apes are small enough), and will usually protect them like just like human members of their 'pack,' but almost always remain very cautious around them, seemingly aware of their intelligence and potential to cause serious injury.

And I've seen cows, sheep, and goats 'react' to gorillas roaming outside of park boundries. Hard to classify as anything more than typical ruminant behavior- stop eating and look for a few seconds. There might be some element of amazement, curiosity or surprise (I couldn't believe they stopped eating and paid any attention), but nothing resembling fear, no fleeing, no vocalizations, etc. Maybe they were just happy not to get charged $375 for gorilla viewing like everyone else?

Apeman

I would be very interested to hear more about this..............

There are also reports of bigfoot being seen on Staten Island and in Central Park in NYC. I don't beleive those either.

I'm not being an a$$, but as far as a b/f creating witches knots (mane weaving) that's total Bullspit. Anything from non grooming to just a twig in a mane or tail can create a "witches knot". It's hogwash to think that ANY horse is going to stand still and let a big HAIRY SOB play with it's main. I guess it's time to dig out my "witches knot" photos. Be back soon.

^^ Yep, what Paint said.

Depending on the horse, as with a human, hair tectures are different. Some can go weeks without a mane or tail being groomed, with limited snarling. Others, like my colt below, has a mane that will develop witches knots overnight (not at the magnitude as seen below, that was a week or two) But the point is, is that these knots are NOT created by a b/f having a horsey main fetish. JMHO, I believe some people want soo badly to believe that b/f have paranormal powers that they can hypnotyze a horse to do things like this.

Witches knots ARE NOT braids. They are snarles of hair that naturally "twist" due to the normal consistancy of the mane, or are created by a bur or piece of debris.

Well, Shucky Darn....The hours I've spent combing and brushing tangles and knots out of horses mane's and tails and all the time I thought they were just tangles and knots, didn't know somebody had a name for them! Hell, I even Googled Witches Knot and came up ziltch....Lol

Thank You Painthorse!!

(my next question was going to be how come nobody has seen a braided Squatch if'n their so handy at the art of braiding :doh: )

Funny, lol.

Littlefoot, the Russians are big on the Bigfoot (Almas, Almasty) braiding thing. Google: 'Almasty horse braids' and you'll pick up a bunch on that. Also, as it turns out, Bigfoot Forums already discussed this very subject on Dec. 30, 2003, by JanV at 11:46am.

For the other naysayers here, I'm not saying I believe BF braiding to be a true phenomenon. What I'm reporting is that I have read about such reports by others on several occasions; (if memory serves me) 2 American reports on this phenomenon and 1 Canadian, the latter mentioned (I think) in one of John Green's first 3 books. I'll see if I can track any of them down, but I'm not going to wast enormous amounts of time on it. As usual it's easy to challenge anyone about less than conventional sighting and encounter phenomena when there is no single, consolidated database to refer back to for reference.

Further, in my opinion, it is always best to set aside questionable phenomena for future consideration and reference, rather than dismissing it out of hand and pissing all over it. No one knows anything, I know nothing for sure about these creatures, so it is nothing more than useless psycho-wanking to dismiss the possible out of hand. Just set it aside and chew on it; maybe someday another related curiosity will become apparent, and then another. The earth did turn out to be round, didn't it? But of course there are still those who believe man never got to the moon, as well.
Dudlow

Excuse me while I get finished with my "psycho-wanking", but the idea of bf braiding knots into horses manes just brings up too many questions for me to believe that it happens. Yup, there have been reports of it on some web sites and by some researchers. Mary Green comes to mind.

A few of those questions are:

1) Why would they choose to braid/knot the manes of some horses and not all horses? Maybe it's only sorrel colored horses manes.

2) Do they also braid/knot the tail of these horses? If not, why?

3) Has anyone every witnessed first hand, a bigfoot braiding/knotting a horses mane? I've never read of it. Anyone else?

4) Do these braids/knots appear overnight in these horses manes? I'd bet they don't.

5) What would be the purpose of a bigfoot caring if a horses mane was braided or not? Fashion statement?

6) Can a bigfoot milk a cow or a goat? You might think that's silly, but not any more silly than thinking a horse would stand still for a tall, hairy, smelly, creature to braid it's mane, or that a bigfoot would want to.

7) Does there come a time when we have to say "enough" and not think every dang thing unusual that we see in this world is bigfoot related? IMO yes there comes that time.

Nothing personal, just my .02 as usual.

What J said.

"Seriously", I'm not a b/f expert, but when it comes to animal behavior, especially horses, I know my sh*t. Just my own personal opinion, I don't care "who", no matter how well known any specific researcher is, that makes claims that a b/f can braid a horse's mane, they have either been lied to by someone who has claimed to witness this type of event, or have their head in the pucky wagon.

<Now back to our scheduled program>

Well I deffinately know why I wouldn't try braiding a horses tail..........But then again, I've been kicked before.

I'm not immediately discounting the notion, but I had never heard of this before. I also haven't researched Russian data on bigfoot. Any accounts involving horses in bigfoot reports that I've come across stated that the horses were agitated.

In the 'The Bigfoot Casebook' Janet and Colin Bord, 1982, there is this report:




I have to admit that I have searched for more info on this and haven't found anything. I guess if a bf could ride a horse, surely he could braid one's mane.

I guess my next question would be...why just horses? I've brushed the same kind of knots and tangles out of outdoor dogs, goats and long haired cats...the end of a cow's tail can get some weird looking knots too. I now have a big ol' Maine Coon who has never been outdoors in his 7 years of life....overnight during shedding season he makes what we jokingly refer to as "works of art" that in some cases, I have to cut out. I'm certainly not going to assume BF is my house at night creating "Witches knots" all over my cat.
I admit I am having some trouble swallowing this idea but I will try to keep an open mind.

Amen, Jaylee, you stole my common sense thoughts on the matter...

I've never read of it either, but now that the question has been asked, I'm sure a report will be taken(probably out of the Eastern US) of someone, somewhere suddenly and miraculously witnessing a BF in the act of braiding a horses mane....and only pausing just long enough to answer his ringing cell phone(with Hong Kong Phooey theme-song ringtone no less) which is Momma BF calling him to scream "CHING BUTU CHA, TU LING HATA CHIWA BUNGA!", which clearly translates as "HEY HOMER, GET YOUR ASS HOME DINNER IS READY!".

Hey, if BF can weave intricate bark-ball play toys, why not?



Yes, and that time has been here for a long long while. It's the wishful-thinkers and daydream-believers that keep the romance alive.

Thank you for this healthy dose common sense, Jay.

I'm with Jay and Vol.

Some of the few things I'm certain of in the BF field:

A UFO did NOT drop one off.

One did not pilot a UFO.

None have teleported.

None have infiltrated the govt. ( Actually that one senator from Montana makes me wonder about that)

None have stolen my car.

And none have attended the Regis school of style in order to better braid a horses mane.

I have to agree with jimf, Jayleed, and Volsquatch, there.

A bigfoot would presumably have big hands, right? So how would it have the dexterity to braid a horses's main fast enough for the horse to stand still without bolting?

If it has trouble keeping US around, why would a skittish/more sense sensitive horse stay around?

A little critical thinking is required here.

Oh, I like that! Hope you don't mind but I'm stealing that one!

No problem-though I'm sure someone else has said it before me!

Probably, but that statement is as good as a swift kick in the seat of the pants if only people will pay attention to it. I just like having it repeated from time to time.

:doh: Shazzam! All this time I've thought the wolves in the yard have been scratching, wallowing, and gnawing dred locks in their hair just behind the ears. If someone had told me sasquatches were doing this sort of thing I could have solved this whole mystery with a video camera. :doh:

I'm with Jaylee and Paint on this one. Even my own hair which is quite long, past my waist and very fine ties itself in little knots overnight that sometimes are so solid they have to be cut out especially if I've slept with a blanket that has been laundered and has the little lint b*lls on it that come loose and knot up in my hair. It takes half a bottle of cream rinse and a pair of scissors at times. No mystery there. I've seen horses walking around with twigs and sticks hanging from their mane and tail from rolling around on the ground, cows with knotted tufts on their tails from twigs, or walking through brush or thickets, and wolves with dred locks behind their ears and sticks hanging off their tail and underbelly, all very natural occurrences.

Much seems far-fetched, but then again, I'd say not too many of us "know" much! (But that is just my 2¢ too!)

Tirademan

bigfoot braiding horse's manes reminds me of something so "romantic"......... I'm just so spellbound, I think I'll go watch harry potter

then all I need is a cape.......

yes hmmmm yes.........

Tirademan, there's a difference between milking a cow and sucking a cow.

I see your point though.

Not saying I believe this horse mane braiding stuff or not (I'm keeping well out of it) but as Dudlow said, the Russians also have their own legends and myths about this, especially among some Kazhakstan herders. Igor Bourtsev came to the conclusion the the manes are done by the horses themsleves when they shake their heads.

However in 1991, hominoid researcher Gregory Panchenko apparantely himself witnessed an Almas braiding a horse's mane. Panchenko had been talking to local herders about this and they directed him to an old barn near Kuruko. Panchenko kept a lone vigil in the barn hiding under an old couch and fell asleep but in the middle of the night at around 3.00 a.m he was awakened by the sound of an Almas in the barn. Panchenko supposedly could see the Almas braiding a mare's mane and making peculiar noises while doing so. The horse was tethered and offered no resistance. The inside of the barn was dark so no photography was possible and besides, Panchenko was worried about giving his location away and revealing himself to the Almas inside the barn. Panchenko was able to witness the Almas inside the barn for 5 minutes before the Almas left. He had no idea how long the Almas had been there before he was awakened.

Panchenko was sure he wasn't the victim of a practical joke given the nature of the locals there and he is sure what he saw was a real Almas. It's looks, the sounds it made and the ability with which it lept to a high window ledge and got out of the barn convinced Panchenko what he saw was real.

Panchenko spent a few more nights at the barn but the Almas never returned.

An interesting story.

Maybe BF is why most wild animals have a natural fear of us Bipedals. Y'know maybe it's an instinctual fear. "Two legs BAD!" kind of thing. That's why it's so hard to get close to wild critters.

oh, and the fact we kill and eat them.

Thank you Lyndon, for your most timely memory (where mine failed concerning the particulars). Now if I could only recall the particulars concerning that very similar account from a ranch in Oregon...

As I said, in my opinion, we need to keep an open mind about such curious reports. We don't have to necessarily believe in them, but we should not utterly dismiss them, either, just because they sound implausible. And thinking and talking about them openly should not lead to ridicule by our fellow enthusiasts here on the Forum. Rather, it should be cause for a pause. Just put it on the shelf as an 'unclassified' because you never know when an old piece of the puzzle may fall into place, no matter how ridiculous, implausible, improbable, etc. it may have seemed at the time. Oddly enough, very often it is the 'exception' reports that lead to breakthroughs.
Dudlow

"Report by Dmitri Bayanov" occupies ten pages (53-62) in his compilation, In the Footsteps of the Russian Snowman, which can be obtained inexpensively on Amazon and contains lots of meat and spice. It was originally published in Bigfoot Co-op for 2/92. It deals the the mane-braiding question--one investigator found a natural explanation, the other found an almasti at work.

Good comment, BeansBaxter. That's been one of my little hobbyhorses too: that animals' "instinctive fear of man" may derive really from a fear of relic hominids.

Dudlow: I agree that "often it is the 'exception' reports that lead to breakthroughs" and that we should put such anomalies "on the shelf."

Yes, that was where I got the above report from Roger. I should have metioned that before. Good book. Cheers!

Dudlow, you are right. I don't dismiss it totally out of hand. The report I mentioned did sound interesting, especially when you add it up with other reports and 'myths' from localsin that area.

Maybe...just maybe, since most of us are unsure as to exactly how an animal might react to something pretty much unkown to all of us (Bigfoot), the responses (or lack thereof) of horses, dogs, cattle, insects might obviously be attributed to the fact that a particularly large or predatory animal is close. As an example, horses are shaken when a stalking cougar is prowling nearby...maybe it's instinctual because a Sasquatch is physically, psychologically or physiologically threatening ? Maybe it's just because they smell so bad, who knows ? I know that when were intruding within close proximity to insects, they'll stop chirping or whatever until weve exited their immediate area, and I doubt that an insect is technically threatened by us or a Bigfoot, but they do react nonetheless. Obviously we (in general) would be scared or at least feel uneasy if a BF was nearing us, I can imagine livestock or birds feeling the same way if a large potential predator was closing in on their space. I could be diving in the ocean, and I definitely know that a Whale Shark is completely harmless to humans, yet I'd still sh*t my wetsuit if I saw one swimming toward me. :help:

Here's something strange that happened to me. I was making my version of a bigfoot "whoop" call when three gray foxes came running out of the woods. I had only made a few calls (5 mins.) when this happened. The foxes were running all over the place in front of me and getting within 10 ft. of me. I thought they acted as if they expected me to feed them. They were excited and curious about me. I would like to add more about this, but I know better than to do that. Nope, nope, nope, ya' can't make me, nope, nope.

Ah,,..........the old Squatch Olympics and clan gathering "cat toss" event, they pick a different neighborhood/town every
ten years.

Edited to add, don't mean to offend cat lovers (had two myself one=time)

I know it sounds weird, Bipedalist, but I think I actually remember the name (which I won't mention) of the sad little girl who came to our door asking if we had see her lost kitten. She was tearfully canvassing the neighborhood; and she was not the only one to do so over the seven years our family lived there. We moved into our first house in that new development in 1956 and then to the second new house in 1958. At the time of moving, each house was successively at the growing edge of the development, surrounded by forest with ponds and a huge acidic bog, pasture, orchards, and tons of mud, etc. Alarmingly enough for the neighborhood children, the cat disappearance phenom took place at both house locations which were only a quarter mile apart. The second location was where the big, white squatchy ran across the backyard at night, parted the neighbor's giant elm hedge and slipped through into their back yard. Due to the long time lag between then and now it might be stretching things a bit, but I believe this little girl lived in the house whose backyard that BF disappeared into. It wasn't until a few years ago that I put two and two together, realizing what might have been happening all along to the cats.
Dudlow

Impressive events for sure, mass catnapping is something to be fearful of........sounds like a connection with white squatchy, just curious about that
Ontario area though, would coyotes and wolves also be giving anything a run for their money during that time period?

Around this neck of the woods, when house cats etc. go missing it is usually a sign that a fisher cat is in the neighborhood. When everyone has been eaten they move on.

hey everyone yes do notice with all sightings of sasquatches that wildlife is realy quiet or act weirdly or scared great new thread. good morning bill

Good question, 'bipedalist'. Answer is possibly yes. I certainly can't rule out other predators.

Back in the 50s the southern Ontario wildlife distribution was much different than it is today. The closest wolves would have been confined to the Canadian Shield, starting about 120 miles north and above; just where they remain today -- so they would not be an issue in this case.

However, there may have been coyotes and coy dogs, although my impression is they moved down into the southwestern Ontario area starting in the mid-60s, when they began to appear in local rural newspaper articles about livestock harassment on the farms - such as in the Stouffville and Uxbridge areas, circa twenty miles or more north of Toronto and about 80 to 100 miles northeast from London -- so that is possible. And while I tend to think it less likely, I honestly don't know for sure about the southern Ontario area around London. Probably the farmers would know about that.

Cougars moved down into the same area in the mid-80s (I know that for sure) and nowadays we even have had two young bears in my Hamilton area in the past 5 years -- unheard of in well over a hundred years or more. So many critters in the pantheon of mid-northern wildlife seem to have been heading south while a lot of southern (American) species have moved north into our area. For example, turkey vultures arrived in southern Ontario skies in the early 80s; now the sky is covered with them almost all year long, with the exception of winter.

I know for sure we had foxes all along; and they certainly could have eaten the cats. So there are some possible predatory alternatives which could account for the cat disappearance. I find it highly suspect, though, and perhaps more than coincidental that the cats fled to the rooftops during their protracted period of ongoing disappearance at the same period that BF was actually observed going through the backyards of our outlying houses at night. There were enough cats around that I imagine they must have been easy pickings for a light snack.

When I first began to tentatively put all of this together a few short years ago I was actually shocked to hear from Dr. Bindernagel that someone else had also reported a BF sighting in the same area of London at around the same time period. I think the corroborating clincher for me, anyway (maybe for both of us), was that my two sightings over a five year period were the same color as the BF report that Dr. had in his private and unpublished files - the rather unusual color of white/silver. So, yes, it is certainly conjecture on my part, but let's say I find the circumstances highly suspicious in favor of the possibility of BF being the culprit.
Dudlow